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    Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Fri May 18, 2012 10:01 pm

    Overrated:

    Overoid
    Carwin
    Kongo
    Nelson
    Faber
    Torres
    Bisping (by some)
    Thiago Silva
    Lil Nog
    Rampage
    Cung Le

    The last two are embarrassingly overrated IMO.

    Underrated:

    Belcher (I've rated him for a long time but not many agreed with me)
    Dos Anjos (See above)
    Bisping (by some)
    Gustafsson
    Jimy Hettes

    There are many fighters in the lower weight classes that are underrated, the majority of the fighters in the FW and BW classes are quite underrated.
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    p4pnumber_1
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  p4pnumber_1 on Sat May 19, 2012 1:12 am

    manschesthair_utd wrote:underrated:

    Shinya Aoki
    Rousimare Palhares
    Rafael Dos Anjos
    Vitor Belfort
    Lyoto Machida
    Thiago Alves
    Fedor Emelianenko


    Overrated:
    Carlos Condit
    Junior Dos Santos
    Frankie Edgar
    Gray Maynard
    Jim Miller
    Dan Henderson
    Anderson Silva

    - not that the above don't deserve their current ranking, but i think they arent as good fighters as they are currently believed to be, or hyped to be.

    Confused by some of these picks here. I would suggest that they could be switched around and would make more sense. In your underrated section you have picked some of the most overrated fighters around in Aoki and Fedor, especially Aoki.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Sat May 19, 2012 1:44 am

    manschesthair_utd wrote:
    redmeanie77 wrote:
    How is Fedor Underated? It was damn near blasphemy to say anything negative in MMA forums just a short while ago, and even when he's lost he is still being worshiped by many out there.



    I forgot Overroid he's the most overated guy in MMA last 3 years.
    I dont think Fedor was undderated when he was considered as #1.

    i think Fedor is underrated by people now because he lost those 3 fights.
    I still think he could beat or at least challenge those fighters who he lost to, as well as those current top 3 in the world.

    he might not be relevant now, but thats because he isnt in the UFC, not because he isnt good enough.
    (in my opinion).

    to pete:

    Edgar is overrated in my opinion, i dont feel the need to elaborate too much, i will just say that he lost to BJ the first time, soundly beaten by Henderson, soundly beaten by fellow overrated Maynard the first time.
    his striking is the annoying style, point fighting style, little power.
    his wrestling is only for points.

    I explained in another thread, i like JDS but he hasnt proven he is anything other than 1 dimensional...and people dont remember this, they consider him as indomitable.
    he is deserved #1 as i said, everyone considers him #1 so how can he be underrated? whats higher than #1?


    cant really talk too much about Palhares having not seen the Belcher fight, so maybe i shouldnt have included him.
    i think based on what ive seen that he would be champ given a shot.

    TBH mate, I'm glad that I was wrong. I personally agreed with most o f what you said, I just know that most, disagree, and I thought that you were amongst them.

    Fedor IS the GOAT, despite what anyone thinks. JDS may be one dimensional, I'm not sure, and Edgar hasn't got a huge amount going for him, other than heart....and he has a huge amount of that, TBH
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Sat May 19, 2012 2:00 am

    How is JDS one-dimensional? When ever he's been on his back he has passed with flying colours, he's so hard to get down as it is anyway. If he's one dimensional, what on earth would you call Aoki?

    JDS might not be able to beat people on the ground but I don't think that makes him one-dimensional at all. He can handle himself on the ground. Unlike Aoki standing.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sat May 19, 2012 2:14 am

    I used to think JDS was one dimensional, I was wrong. He's far from it. He's just so good at one aspect of the game he doesn't need to use the others. He can destroy any HW in the world with his hands. His boxing is good enough that if he wanted he could switch to boxing and make a decent run at the HW title. Why would he bother with anything else when he has that much of an advantage standing?
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    Sheldan
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Sheldan on Sat May 19, 2012 2:35 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:I used to think JDS was one dimensional, I was wrong.

    It has finally happened! Anfield has admitted he was wrong about something! Very Happy haha
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sat May 19, 2012 4:18 am

    Aye it's happened before. Once. Then on further evaluation I realized I was right.

    If JDS gets tapped by Mir we have have to re-evaluate.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Sat May 19, 2012 10:54 am

    As I said, he may be one dimensional, I don't think that anyone can say with any degree of certainty, until he's been fully tested. He has got a huge advantage over most HWs in the stand up, but that doesn't mean that he isn't one dimensional......And as for Aoki, I love watching him fight, but, just because he is massively one dimensional, doesn't make any other fighter not, surely? Or is there only room for one fighter to be one dimensional?
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    manschesthair_utd
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  manschesthair_utd on Sat May 19, 2012 11:44 am

    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:How is JDS one-dimensional? When ever he's been on his back he has passed with flying colours, he's so hard to get down as it is anyway. If he's one dimensional, what on earth would you call Aoki?

    JDS might not be able to beat people on the ground but I don't think that makes him one-dimensional at all. He can handle himself on the ground. Unlike Aoki standing.

    I didnt say he was one dimensional at all!
    i said he has yet to prove otherwise, and so many people talk about him like he is indomitable. THATS why i listed him as overrated.

    of course Aoki is one dimensional but its not as if people claim him to be otherwise...
    in fact many people claim he would lose to most UFC fighters, which i disagree (same about fedor). THATS why he is underrated.

    i think its not too hard to understand my lists, if you think about the actual meaning of overrated and underrated.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Sat May 19, 2012 4:13 pm

    Pete

    I was referring to what Chesty said, which I kind of misunderstood but he had JDS as overrated and said he might be one-dimensional as a justification. At the same time he had Aoki as underrated.

    Even if he was one-dimensional it doesn't mean he is overrated. Wasn't Cro Cop slightly one-dimensional? Nog? Werdum? Are any of those fighters overrated? (well Cro Cop is Razz )

    And as I said, I disagree JDS is one-dimensional or overrated, I haven't heard anyone talk about him like he is indomitable, just that he is the number one HW in the world which is clearly true. He's shown good take down ability and he's handled himself well on the ground. Again, just because he can't finish all fights on the ground doesn't mean he is one-dimensional.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Sun May 20, 2012 6:45 pm

    Spoiler:
    After last night, I think we could throw either Barnett in the overrated section, or Cormier in the underrated section, or both. Barnett really had no answer, to a very solid game plan from Cormier. I had thought that Cormier may well have been overrated initially, and thought that he would be found out by Barnett, but that was a very one sided fight
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sun May 20, 2012 8:28 pm

    I don't think we throw either of them anywhere. Barnett's age just seems to have caught up with him. This is a guy who was fighting for money when Cormier was just beginning his college wrestling career.

    Cormier's 5th round was pathetic though, I have no respect for anyone that literally runs away like he did at the end.
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Sheldan on Sun May 20, 2012 8:33 pm

    I don't see what the problem was with the 5th round, for one Cormier had broke his hand and also he was clearly 4-0 up so there was no need for him to engage and risk getting beat. It's no different to a football team keeping the ball in the corner during injury time.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Sun May 20, 2012 9:09 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:I don't think we throw either of them anywhere. Barnett's age just seems to have caught up with him. This is a guy who was fighting for money when Cormier was just beginning his college wrestling career.

    Cormier's 5th round was pathetic though, I have no respect for anyone that literally runs away like he did at the end.

    Not certain that we can say it's purely because of age can we? He's 34, but hasn't fought more than a couple of times a year since about 2008. It hasn't been a gradual decline either though, has it? I honestly think that Cormier is destined for big things, he's got an awesome wrestling background, and has a lot of power in those hands. I cannot remember the last time I saw Barnett manhandled like that.


    I can understand both sides to the Cormier comment, of course I like fighters that constantly look for the finish, but, we've seen in the past, the stupidity of looking for the spectacular, when a fight is in the bag. Maybe a change in scoring would change all of that, but, until it is changed, I don't see any major issue, with a fighter 'playing' to those rules. It's not as if he danced away all fight, and as Sheldan said, it was in the bag at that point. I remember shouting obscenities at the TV, when Hardy decided to take Lyttle to the floor, when I thought he had that fight in the bank.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Sun May 20, 2012 10:47 pm

    Scary performance from Cormier, he wiped the floor with one of the best HWs of all time. To manhandle a juicehead like he did was incredible, Barnett got destroyed. I think he poses the biggest threat to JDS in the division. Not sure about him going to LHW but as Meanie said, he's the only one I can see troubling Jones. He represents the new generation of fighters, well rounded and incredibly athletic. I think he would wipe the floor with Overoid, Werdum, Mir, Carwin, basically any HW not named JDS or Velasquez and I could see him troubling both as well. Hope he sticks to HW for now and maybe in the future Jones will move up.

    Gutted for Thompson as well last night, I thought he had it in the 4th. Melendez almost let it slip away but I hope we finally see him in the UFC. Both deserve a spot and I honestly wouldn't be against seeing these two fight again in the future.

    JZ continues to waste his talent from what I hear but I didn't watch the fight so I can't really comment.
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  p4pnumber_1 on Sun May 20, 2012 10:51 pm

    Mamed Khalidov is another very underrated fighter.
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Cowboys From Hell on Sun May 20, 2012 10:55 pm

    p4pnumber_1 wrote:Mamed Khalidov is another very underrated fighter.

    Agreed, I'm sure I read he said after the Wallace KO at KSW XIX he wants to go to the UFC.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon May 21, 2012 5:49 am

    Once Mohawked Pete wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:I don't think we throw either of them anywhere. Barnett's age just seems to have caught up with him. This is a guy who was fighting for money when Cormier was just beginning his college wrestling career.

    Cormier's 5th round was pathetic though, I have no respect for anyone that literally runs away like he did at the end.

    Not certain that we can say it's purely because of age can we? He's 34, but hasn't fought more than a couple of times a year since about 2008. It hasn't been a gradual decline either though, has it? I honestly think that Cormier is destined for big things, he's got an awesome wrestling background, and has a lot of power in those hands. I cannot remember the last time I saw Barnett manhandled like that.


    I can understand both sides to the Cormier comment, of course I like fighters that constantly look for the finish, but, we've seen in the past, the stupidity of looking for the spectacular, when a fight is in the bag. Maybe a change in scoring would change all of that, but, until it is changed, I don't see any major issue, with a fighter 'playing' to those rules. It's not as if he danced away all fight, and as Sheldan said, it was in the bag at that point. I remember shouting obscenities at the TV, when Hardy decided to take Lyttle to the floor, when I thought he had that fight in the bank.

    The body can catch up on you in two ways though Pete, can be a slow and natural decline, OR if like Barnett you've been juicing and you suddenly stop it can be an instant and nasty decline. Look at CroCop. He was the 2nd best HW in the world when he left Pride and a year later he was as good as done.

    Not saying Cormier had to keep hitting Barnett, but Barnett wasn't going to KO him so running away is just cowardly.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon May 21, 2012 5:51 am

    Sheldan wrote:I don't see what the problem was with the 5th round, for one Cormier had broke his hand and also he was clearly 4-0 up so there was no need for him to engage and risk getting beat. It's no different to a football team keeping the ball in the corner during injury time.

    It's completely different. It's similar to what Chelsea did against Barca, time wasting, falling over pretending to be hurt etc.

    Barnett was NEVER going to knock him out so he wasn't going to get beat standing. And talking about his hand is nonsense. Barnett broke his in the first round and fought on and kept throwing it. He never turned and ran away.
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    manschesthair_utd
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  manschesthair_utd on Mon May 21, 2012 5:32 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    Sheldan wrote:I don't see what the problem was with the 5th round, for one Cormier had broke his hand and also he was clearly 4-0 up so there was no need for him to engage and risk getting beat. It's no different to a football team keeping the ball in the corner during injury time.

    It's completely different. It's similar to what Chelsea did against Barca, time wasting, falling over pretending to be hurt etc.

    Barnett was NEVER going to knock him out so he wasn't going to get beat standing. And talking about his hand is nonsense. Barnett broke his in the first round and fought on and kept throwing it. He never turned and ran away.

    Barnett's hand

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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Mon May 21, 2012 6:18 pm

    What round did Cormier break his hand him? It was always going to be a tough fight for Barnett, Someone he wasnt likely to take down who has more KO power than him but I think he had a hell of a go for someone with a broken hand, Who knows if he wouldnt have sunk in that kneebar is his hand was ok...

    Cracking performance by Cormier though. I think he diserves to be thought of really highly after his last 2 fights, KO power in his fights can slam 250lbs guys like Flyweights and can throw a headkick! Scary guy!

    Hope Barnett still goes to UFC, he was in the best shape ive ever seen him in this fight. Fights with Carwin, Mir, Werdum.. there are a load of figths id still love to see him in.

    Wonder if they still want Cormier to have 1 more fight. Cormier fighting and loosing would make the GP a disaster because the only good thing that came of it was Cormier being made an instant star.
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Cowboys From Hell on Mon May 21, 2012 7:13 pm

    Apparently Cormier has one fight left on his contract I believe Showtime inserted the clause for the GP winner.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Mon May 21, 2012 7:46 pm

    Didn't realise that Barnett's hand was damaged that badly. I've had a similar break to that, and it fucking hurt (even with adrenaline kicking in). I will retract what I said earlier about Barnett, and put it down to injury.
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  p4pnumber_1 on Mon May 21, 2012 10:03 pm

    Wow thats some break. Did he break it early in the first? If that is the case, what an achievement it is to fight five rounds with that!! Shocked
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Most underrated and most overrated fighters in the UFC?

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Tue May 22, 2012 12:28 am

    Apparently 2-3 minutes into the first round.

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