Anfields5thKing wrote: ChelseaQuinsfan wrote: Anfields5thKing wrote:Wow. 4 goals from a couple of years ago? Well done. He's a hit and hope merchant. The dip on the ball comes from the positioning of the ball and kicking through the valve. It was perfected by this man:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuKIWfg_j1U. Those are free kicks taken properly. Ronaldo has taken his technique but fails miserably at it 9 times out of 10.
The rest of your post is comical nonsense.
Messi has scored less than Ronaldo in the past because he's a creator rather than a selfish player like Ronaldo. This season he is easily ahead of Ronaldo in both categories because he's better at both. You claimed Ronaldo was more complete and tried to use golden boot to prove it. Comical argument. And pointless because Messi has one won it and is on track to win it again this year. Henrik Larsson is not the only player in scotland to win the golden boot. Ally McCoist won it. twice. And Brian Laudrup is the best player to ever play in Scotland.
Ronaldo plays as a winger for Real and has countless opportunities to shoot from distance, but his shooting is not great. Hence he has not 200 shots that have not resulted in goals.
Coentrao is more complete than Vidic? What are you talking about. 1 is a centre back, 1 is a fullback converted from a winger. They play completely different positions! Ronaldo and Messi plays similar positions.
When Ronaldo was Messi's age, he was just leaving United. Messi is so much better than the United-era Ronaldo it's untrue. He's also far better than the current version despite Ronaldo being in his peak years and Messi still being a few years away from them.
Career stats set Messi far apart from Ronaldo, despite being so much younger.
The goal against Bosnia was quite recent. Anyway it doesn't matter when he took them, the fact is he did it and I can show you more recent examples. Juhninio is the greatest free kick taker ever, he's better than Ronaldo and Messi combined. No one in the current game even comes close to him so ofc players will try copy his style. Drogba has tried to copy the technique multiple times. The fact that Ronaldo attempts to copy the technique shows he isn't a hit and hope merchant because it's one of the hardest way to hit a free kick. In fact, if he was a hit and hope merchant he would probably be more successful because he has incredible power.
Ronaldo is a creator as well hence all the assists he has for both Utd and Madrid. He was more of a creator at Real Madrid when he had Rooney alongside him. Anyway Messi is the better creator, for me that's clear and that's not what I'm arguing. This season Ronaldo has more goals in the league and he still has time to win it. I didn't use the golden boot to prove Ronaldo was the more complete player, I used it to prove he was the better goal scorer which he is. To score more goals than you have appearances in La Liga is just unbelievable, especially when he isn't even a striker. He's won it twice in two different leagues and each time he won it he was playing in the best league in the world.
Sorry you are right about McCoist, but he is one of the best players to ever play in Scotland as well. The Scottish league was also stronger in his day. Laudrup is probably the best player to play in Scotland but he was already long established before he came and he only spent 3 seasons. Larsson IMO was more influential in Scotland. Gascoigne is a better player than Larsson as well but no one other player can replicate the dynasty Larsson created at Celtic. In Scotland, Larsson was better than Laudrup and everyone else.
He plays as a striker as well and has played their countless times. He's played their at times ahead of the established strikers. The way Madrid play restricts his ability to shoot from distance. Either way Ronaldo is clearly better at shooting from distance than Messi.
It's just an example, but a pretty dumb one I must admit. Ok, O Shea and Ferdinand are both more complete footballers than Vidic but neither are even close to his level. Having more attributes your games doesn't necessarily make you a better player, it makes you more versatile and that's not always the best thing.
Ronaldo is 2-3 years older than Messi, the age difference isn't huge. The United version of Ronaldo was a magnificent player as well, not as good as Messi but still far better than any other player in the world. He didn't score as many goals but his all round game was sensational.
Messi is the best player in the world, Ronaldo second and when fit Inieta is third but by some distance.
Iniesta is better than Ronaldo. Superior all round player, also performs on the big stage whilst Ronaldo chokes constantly under pressure.
That is a big age difference in football. An average career is 12 years at the highest level, Ronaldo is 1/4 of the way further through his career and Messi is vastly superior and has accomplished far more than Ronaldo. Messi could retire now and it's unlikely Ronaldo would match his achievements.
I stopped reading at "O'Shea".
Never plays as a striker for Real. Has been left wing since the day he arrived. Higuain and Benzema are always upfront and Real never play with 2 strikers. Di Maria-Ozil-Ronaldo or Ozil-Kaka-Ronaldo has been the constant attacking midfield trio.
When Laudrup was at Rangers he was on another level to everyone in the league, just like Larsson. Their performances in Scotland were about on a par, but overall Laudrup was the better player. That being said, Henrik Larsson is the best striker to ever play there and arguably the biggest bargain in football history. 700k for that level of talent? You'd never see that today. Shame he didn't move to England in his prime.
Ronaldo only passes when he has no chance to shoot. Only twice in his career has he managed 10 or more league assists in a season. He's got far better team-mates now than he did at United yet his assist numbers are very poor. Messi is on course for his fifth season of 10 or more in a row. Ronaldo has played 2 seasons more than Messi as well which shows just how big the gulf is. Ronaldo is 2 goals ahead of Messi in the league this season having played a game more. Given that two of his team-mates are the top creators in the league, that's not surprising. As for the comical claim that Ronaldo is the better goalscorer, look at their career stats.
Messi is far more prolific. His career goals per game record is better than Ronaldo's. 450 club games and 249 goals for Ronaldo. 312 club games for Messi, 230 goals. It really isn't close. And then there's the shots to goals facts. Last season, just as example, Ronaldo scored 53 club goals. He needed 323 shots to do so. Messi also scored 53 club goals last season. He needed only 229 shots to do so. Same number of goals, 94 shots less. This season he has 50 from 191. Ronaldo has 44 goals from 242.
He's a hit and hope merchant and striking a ball that way, when you practice it, isn't all that much harder than taking free kicks normally according to Juninho himself. Ronaldo doesn't use the actual kicking technique of Juninho. He seems to be under the illusion that it's all about kicking the ball as hard as he can. Juninho didn't kick at anything close to full power unless he was 35 yards or more out. Ronaldo stole the ball placement and the idea and tries to replicate the technique but he's awful at it because unlike Juninho he doesn't spend hours per day practicing and he tries to kick too hard. Messi also spends hours per day practicing his technique, Ronaldo doesn't bother. Like I said 50 free kicks this season, no goals. His attempts to goal record from free kicks throughout the last 5 years is nothing short of appalling.
Iniesta is a sensational player and actually out of the three is my favourite but I think Ronaldo has him beat. Iniesta's form over the last season or two has dipped because of injuries. This talk of Ronaldo being a choker is severely overblown. He's under performed in big matches in the past yes, so has Messi and Iniesta. But he's scored in the CL final, Copa Del Ray final and countless times in big games in England. Remember when he destroyed Arsenal in the CL? He hasn't played well against Barcelona because Real Madrid just can't cope with them. In the last couple of games, the entire RM team has under performed against Barca.
Just have a look at Messi in the World cup, was completely non-existent. Mostly it was due to not having Xavi and Iniesta.
Messi have accomplished more playing for the best side in this generation. Xavi and Iniesta have accomplished more than both Messi and Ronaldo, but I wouldn't necessarily call them better players. Ronaldo has also proved himself in two leagues, both the best in the world. He's about to win his first league title in Spain, has already finished as top scorer ect. If Messi retired now, Ronaldo could easily surpass his achievements. Barca would lose their best player and Ronaldo would be the best player in the world meaning he would have little competition for the Golden ball, ballon dr ect.
Clearly you haven't seen Real Madrid play very often then because he plays there on a regular basis.
I agree their performances were about on par but I think Larsson's longevity gives him the edge. Also Laudrap was already an established player when he arrived in Scotland while Larsson was relatively unknown. Larsson was an incredible player, if he moved to England in his prime I think he would have been up there with the likes of Shearar and Henry. For me he was far better than the likes of Andy Cole, Dwight Yorke ect.
He passes plenty but has just gained a reputation as a selfish player which he is at times. The 2007-8 Utd team he played in was the best team he played in and he had plenty of assists. His partnership with Rooney was devastating but for Madrid he is their main goal scorer. That's why he plays more central nowadays. Messi has two team mates near the top of the assist's leagues. Aside from Messi and ROnaldo, both RM and Barca have 3 players in the top 10 for assists. Barca has the MF in the world by far with Xavi, Iniesta and Fabregas not to mention Alves on the right. Messi plays in a better team but Ronaldo scores more. Ronaldo has two more goals and one less assist having played a game more. Shows how close they are.
Those stats prove Messi is more efficient, Ronaldo deserves his own credit for creating so many chances in the first place. Messi's career total is better than Ronaldo but you aren't considering Ronaldo played in a very defensive league in England. Messi has played in the same league his entire career and it's the most attacking league in the world by far. A better way to compare them is in La Liga where Ronaldo has 98 goals in 89 appearances in the league and 126 in 127 overall. Messi has 147 in 201 in the league and 228 in 311 overall. After 2 seasons and a half Ronaldo has 98 league goals compared to Messi who had 21 in his first 3 seasons. In the two previous seasons combined Messi scored 65 in 68 while Ronaldo scored 66 in 63. More goals in less games, Ronaldo is the better goal scorer.
Ronaldo is one of the hardest trainers in world football, everyone at Madrid says he trains non stop hence his unbelievable fitness. When he played for United he didn't always hit as hard as he could, you could see the technique in his shots. Again it was the 2007-08 where he was just incredible, the dip he had on the ball was incredible. During Euro 2008 every time Portugal got a threatening free kick, all his team mates wanted him to take it. I'm sure the dipping free kick isn't hard for Juhninio but it is for just about every other human being on the planet. Can't remember exactly but Junihio has something like 44 goals from free kicks. Don't think any other player has anything close to that, after a while I'm sure it becomes easy. Ronaldo has about 20+ goals in his career from free kicks, far more than Messi.