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    The_Axe_Emperor
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  The_Axe_Emperor on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:27 pm

    Which Brazillian you referring to Anfield, Lucas?
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:33 pm

    Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.
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    Sheldan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Sheldan on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:35 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.

    Signed Lucas Moura and Gotze for United on football manager too Wink city got Hazard though the bastards! Just thought I would let you all know Very Happy
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:37 pm

    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:He saved his country from elimination. If there is a player in any team that would not do the same, they should retire immediately.

    But that's not answering my question, why does him cheating by purposely handballing not make him a cheat?

    To cheat is to purposely attempt to gain an advantage by breaking the rules.

    Suarez didn't try to gain an advantage. He knew he was going to get caught. He was sent off and Ghana got a penalty. There was no advantage to his team. None. Uruguay also had to finish the game without him, their best player. And partake in a penalty shoot-out without him and at the time he was good penalty taker.

    What Suarez did is no worse to committing a professional foul. It's going to be a penalty and red card. Defenders know that. They react/gamble. Suarez reacted in an instant, it's not like he thought about what he was doing.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:40 pm

    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.

    Signed Lucas Moura and Gotze for United on football manager too Wink city got Hazard though the bastards! Just thought I would let you all know Very Happy

    You must have a ridiculously good team!

    Are Mateo Kovacic and Julian Draxler any good on FM? Those two lead the next generation of great young players coming through after the Hazard/Gotze/Neymar/Moura/Eriksen group IMO.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:47 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:

    As for Ronaldo, I think he's a more complete player than Messi

    That's hilarious. More complete? Jesus wept.

    Can head the ball better, shoot from distance better, better from free kicks, more athletic and has better fitness. Messi can pass and dribble better. Pace is about equal.

    Better from freekicks? Ronaldo is shit at freekicks! 50 freekick attempts this year, ZERO goals. He's a hit and hope merchant. Messi is far better at freekicks.

    More athletic? Better fitness? They have nothing to do with football ability. Glen Johnson is more athletic and has better fitness than Wayne Rooney, does that contribute to him being a better player than Rooney? Does it fuck.

    Messi has more goals from outside the box over the past 2 seasons than Ronaldo.

    He's better at heading. that's about his lot.

    Messi is better in every other aspect. Passing, dribbling, creatively, crossing, work-rate, scoring, shooting in general(look at the goals per shots stats) two footedness (Messi scores more with his right than Ronaldo does with his left).

    He's had a poor season with free kicks but that doesn't mean he is shit with them. Absolutely comical to call him a hit and hope merchant when you look at some of the free kicks he scored for Man Utd. Messi is a clever free kick taker, he knows how catch the keeper out but in terms of technique and power Ronaldo has him beat.

    They don't have anything with football ability but they do play a part making a complete footballer. Pace and fitness are two vital parts of football and I seriously doubt Johnson is either faster or fitter than Rooney. Possibly fast but in the speed test a couple of years ago Rooney scored in the top 5.

    Ronaldo's goals from outside the box have dried up a little since he plays more forward for Madrid. At United when he played on the wing and cut in he scored plenty of goals from the outside. Ronaldo is a far better shooter from distance.

    Ronaldo's a terrific crosser but again because of where he plays you don't see it as much.

    Ronaldo has won the European golden shoe twice and has 126 goals in a 127 appearances for Madrid including a truly astonishing 98 goals in 89 appearances in the league. IMO it's extremely close between the two when it comes to who the better goal scorer is. I agree with the rest.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:49 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:What Suarez did was cheating. Whether it was the right thing to do is down to opinion, but it was cheating pure and simple. Exactly the same as Henry vs Ireland except everyone was bitching when Henry did it.

    Henry didn't need to do that though. France weren't going to be eliminated if he hadn't done it. Completely different circumstance, very poor attempt at comparison.

    Cheating to win and cheating not to lose still constitutes as cheating.
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    Sheldan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Sheldan on Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:57 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.

    Signed Lucas Moura and Gotze for United on football manager too Wink city got Hazard though the bastards! Just thought I would let you all know Very Happy

    You must have a ridiculously good team!

    Are Mateo Kovacic and Julian Draxler any good on FM? Those two lead the next generation of great young players coming through after the Hazard/Gotze/Neymar/Moura/Eriksen group IMO.

    In 2016 at the moment, my first choice 11 is:

    De Gea - GK
    Smalling - RB
    Jones - CB
    Vidic - CB
    Coentrao - LB
    M'Villa - DMF
    Gotze - LW
    Moura - AM
    Navas - RW
    Rooney - FW
    Neymar - FW

    Kovacic is at City, currently on loan at Athletico Madrid on my game, for some reason Draxler isn't even in the game.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:10 am

    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:

    As for Ronaldo, I think he's a more complete player than Messi

    That's hilarious. More complete? Jesus wept.

    Can head the ball better, shoot from distance better, better from free kicks, more athletic and has better fitness. Messi can pass and dribble better. Pace is about equal.

    Better from freekicks? Ronaldo is shit at freekicks! 50 freekick attempts this year, ZERO goals. He's a hit and hope merchant. Messi is far better at freekicks.

    More athletic? Better fitness? They have nothing to do with football ability. Glen Johnson is more athletic and has better fitness than Wayne Rooney, does that contribute to him being a better player than Rooney? Does it fuck.

    Messi has more goals from outside the box over the past 2 seasons than Ronaldo.

    He's better at heading. that's about his lot.

    Messi is better in every other aspect. Passing, dribbling, creatively, crossing, work-rate, scoring, shooting in general(look at the goals per shots stats) two footedness (Messi scores more with his right than Ronaldo does with his left).

    He's had a poor season with free kicks but that doesn't mean he is shit with them. Absolutely comical to call him a hit and hope merchant when you look at some of the free kicks he scored for Man Utd. Messi is a clever free kick taker, he knows how catch the keeper out but in terms of technique and power Ronaldo has him beat.

    They don't have anything with football ability but they do play a part making a complete footballer. Pace and fitness are two vital parts of football and I seriously doubt Johnson is either faster or fitter than Rooney. Possibly fast but in the speed test a couple of years ago Rooney scored in the top 5.

    Ronaldo's goals from outside the box have dried up a little since he plays more forward for Madrid. At United when he played on the wing and cut in he scored plenty of goals from the outside. Ronaldo is a far better shooter from distance.

    Ronaldo's a terrific crosser but again because of where he plays you don't see it as much.

    Ronaldo has won the European golden shoe twice and has 126 goals in a 127 appearances for Madrid including a truly astonishing 98 goals in 89 appearances in the league. IMO it's extremely close between the two when it comes to who the better goal scorer is. I agree with the rest.

    Yeah his one goal every 12 freekicks for United REALLY boosts his numbers don't they! He was abysmal from freekicks last year and the year before too. Hit and hope merchant. Always has been.

    Glen Johnson is the fittest player in the england squad and whenever they do bleep tests he wins or finishes second. Ashley Cole is the only one to have beaten him. Fitness and athleticism have no bearing on being a more rounded footballer. If anything, Ronaldo having an advantage in those aspects shows just how much better of a player Messi is.

    Ronaldo plays as a left winger for Real. His crossing has been poor for years. And his goals from distance have dried up because his shooting is nowhere near as good as you think. Look at his number.

    Messi has won world player of the year THREE TIMES IN A ROW. It's not even close. Golden Shoe? Players from Scotland have won that!


    Last edited by Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:12 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:11 am

    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:What Suarez did was cheating. Whether it was the right thing to do is down to opinion, but it was cheating pure and simple. Exactly the same as Henry vs Ireland except everyone was bitching when Henry did it.

    Henry didn't need to do that though. France weren't going to be eliminated if he hadn't done it. Completely different circumstance, very poor attempt at comparison.

    Cheating to win and cheating not to lose still constitutes as cheating.

    No they don't. Look up the meaning of cheating.

    Attempting to gain an advantage by breaking the rules.

    Henry tried to gain an advantage, Suarez did not. Uruguay gained no advantage from his actions.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:17 am

    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.

    Signed Lucas Moura and Gotze for United on football manager too Wink city got Hazard though the bastards! Just thought I would let you all know Very Happy

    You must have a ridiculously good team!

    Are Mateo Kovacic and Julian Draxler any good on FM? Those two lead the next generation of great young players coming through after the Hazard/Gotze/Neymar/Moura/Eriksen group IMO.

    In 2016 at the moment, my first choice 11 is:

    De Gea - GK
    Smalling - RB
    Jones - CB
    Vidic - CB
    Coentrao - LB
    M'Villa - DMF
    Gotze - LW
    Moura - AM
    Navas - RW
    Rooney - FW
    Neymar - FW

    Kovacic is at City, currently on loan at Athletico Madrid on my game, for some reason Draxler isn't even in the game.

    Did you run out of money for your defence?

    Bizarre that Draxler's not in the game.
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    Sheldan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Sheldan on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:20 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    Sheldan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:Yeah Lucas Moura. Another ridiculous talent. In 3 years the top 5 players in the world will be Messi, the two Brazilians, Hazard and Gotze.

    Signed Lucas Moura and Gotze for United on football manager too Wink city got Hazard though the bastards! Just thought I would let you all know Very Happy

    You must have a ridiculously good team!

    Are Mateo Kovacic and Julian Draxler any good on FM? Those two lead the next generation of great young players coming through after the Hazard/Gotze/Neymar/Moura/Eriksen group IMO.

    In 2016 at the moment, my first choice 11 is:

    De Gea - GK
    Smalling - RB
    Jones - CB
    Vidic - CB
    Coentrao - LB
    M'Villa - DMF
    Gotze - LW
    Moura - AM
    Navas - RW
    Rooney - FW
    Neymar - FW

    Kovacic is at City, currently on loan at Athletico Madrid on my game, for some reason Draxler isn't even in the game.

    Did you run out of money for your defence?

    Bizarre that Draxler's not in the game.

    Yeah I'm skint, had to sell Rafael to Spurs for £20 million just so I could get out of debt. Coentrao is a good player though.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:36 am

    20mil for Rafael!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

    Jesus! How much for a good defender?

    Vidic must be getting on a bit!
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    The_Axe_Emperor
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  The_Axe_Emperor on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:52 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:What Suarez did was cheating. Whether it was the right thing to do is down to opinion, but it was cheating pure and simple. Exactly the same as Henry vs Ireland except everyone was bitching when Henry did it.

    Henry didn't need to do that though. France weren't going to be eliminated if he hadn't done it. Completely different circumstance, very poor attempt at comparison.

    Cheating to win and cheating not to lose still constitutes as cheating.

    No they don't. Look up the meaning of cheating.

    Attempting to gain an advantage by breaking the rules.

    Henry tried to gain an advantage, Suarez did not. Uruguay gained no advantage from his actions.


    Two very hypocritical statements. Uruguay got the biggest advantage possible, they stayed in the competition because of his save!!
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:57 am

    Not at all.

    Henry's handball made the goal that put France through. France gained an advantage.

    Suarez's handball gave Ghana a penalty and got him send off. Uruguay no advantage from the handball. It was a draw with 11 players each when he handled the ball. Ghana were given a penalty and Suarez was sent off. there's no advantage to Uruguay in that situation. What transpired afterwards put Uruguay through, not the handball. Handball stopped them going out. It didn't put them through.
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    The_Axe_Emperor
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  The_Axe_Emperor on Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:01 am

    I didn't say it put them through, but it did keep them in it, which you agree with. He broke the rules to keep his team in the competition, that's cheating and it shouldn't even be up for debate really... If John Terry had been in Suarez' position here, would you defend Terry's actions? I don't think so.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:06 am

    It's not cheating. Breaking the rules knowing you are going to get caught is not cheating. His team gained no advantage. They were in a worse situation after his handball than before it.

    I would defend ANY player who did what Suarez did. Any player who wouldn't do it has no business being a professional.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:16 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:
    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:

    As for Ronaldo, I think he's a more complete player than Messi

    That's hilarious. More complete? Jesus wept.

    Can head the ball better, shoot from distance better, better from free kicks, more athletic and has better fitness. Messi can pass and dribble better. Pace is about equal.

    Better from freekicks? Ronaldo is shit at freekicks! 50 freekick attempts this year, ZERO goals. He's a hit and hope merchant. Messi is far better at freekicks.

    More athletic? Better fitness? They have nothing to do with football ability. Glen Johnson is more athletic and has better fitness than Wayne Rooney, does that contribute to him being a better player than Rooney? Does it fuck.

    Messi has more goals from outside the box over the past 2 seasons than Ronaldo.

    He's better at heading. that's about his lot.

    Messi is better in every other aspect. Passing, dribbling, creatively, crossing, work-rate, scoring, shooting in general(look at the goals per shots stats) two footedness (Messi scores more with his right than Ronaldo does with his left).

    He's had a poor season with free kicks but that doesn't mean he is shit with them. Absolutely comical to call him a hit and hope merchant when you look at some of the free kicks he scored for Man Utd. Messi is a clever free kick taker, he knows how catch the keeper out but in terms of technique and power Ronaldo has him beat.

    They don't have anything with football ability but they do play a part making a complete footballer. Pace and fitness are two vital parts of football and I seriously doubt Johnson is either faster or fitter than Rooney. Possibly fast but in the speed test a couple of years ago Rooney scored in the top 5.

    Ronaldo's goals from outside the box have dried up a little since he plays more forward for Madrid. At United when he played on the wing and cut in he scored plenty of goals from the outside. Ronaldo is a far better shooter from distance.

    Ronaldo's a terrific crosser but again because of where he plays you don't see it as much.

    Ronaldo has won the European golden shoe twice and has 126 goals in a 127 appearances for Madrid including a truly astonishing 98 goals in 89 appearances in the league. IMO it's extremely close between the two when it comes to who the better goal scorer is. I agree with the rest.

    Yeah his one goal every 12 freekicks for United REALLY boosts his numbers don't they! He was abysmal from freekicks last year and the year before too. Hit and hope merchant. Always has been.

    Glen Johnson is the fittest player in the england squad and whenever they do bleep tests he wins or finishes second. Ashley Cole is the only one to have beaten him. Fitness and athleticism have no bearing on being a more rounded footballer. If anything, Ronaldo having an advantage in those aspects shows just how much better of a player Messi is.

    Ronaldo plays as a left winger for Real. His crossing has been poor for years. And his goals from distance have dried up because his shooting is nowhere near as good as you think. Look at his number.

    Messi has won world player of the year THREE TIMES IN A ROW. It's not even close. Golden Shoe? Players from Scotland have won that!

    This is not from a player who is a hit and hope merchant, far from it.



    or this




    Just look at how the ball dips, perfection.


    I haven't heard that anywhere about Johnson, it's interesting if it's true. If you can find a link somewhere I would appreciate it. Anyway, fitness and pace do have impacts on a footballers ability. Take Johnson for example, what career would he have without his fitness and pace. Ronaldo's pace make him a threat on the break, adding another dimension to his game and his fitness levels which are incredible help him play better for longer. A players all round game could suffer without pace or fitness, Gareth Barry being a prime example. I'm not arguing over who the better player is, I'm arguing over who the more complete player is. Fabio Coentrao is a more complete player than Vidic, and I certainly wouldn't call him a better player.

    Ronaldo moves around from wing to striker, but he often ends up very high up the pitch. He also prefers cutting in and taking the shot himself. His shooting from distance is pure quality





    His goals from distance have dried up because of a) his positioning and b) the way Real Madrid. Utd were happy a lot of time time to sit back, control the ball and shoot from distance. Madrid play more attack minded and they try and work themselves into better positions.

    What does the world player of the year have to do with who's a better goal scorer? Again, I'm not debating that Messi is the better player, certainly not at the moment. This particular debate was over who was the better goal scorer.

    The only player to win the golden shoe in Scotland was Henrik Larsson who was a fantastic player, probably the best player to play in Scotland. Anyway it's irrelevant because Ronaldo didn't win the Golden shoe playing in Scotland, he won it while playing in England AND Spain. Only player to ever do it in two leagues. He also won it when those leagues were the best in the world. Not to mention he has the record for goals scored in a single La Liga season which happened last. 41 goals in 34 appearances compared to Messi who had 31 goals in 33 apperances the same year. Ronaldo is marginally the better goal scorer IMO.
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    ChelseaQuinsfan
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:24 am

    Not at all.

    Henry's handball made the goal that put France through. France gained an advantage.

    Suarez's handball gave Ghana a penalty and got him send off. Uruguay no advantage from the handball. It was a draw with 11 players each when he handled the ball. Ghana were given a penalty and Suarez was sent off. there's no advantage to Uruguay in that situation. What transpired afterwards put Uruguay through, not the handball. Handball stopped them going out. It didn't put them through.

    Ofc it gave Uruguay an advantage, if he didn't do it they would have gone out! Anything, including a penalty and a red card is a more of an advantage than letting the goal go in, therefore Suarez is a cheater by your own definition.

    Here's the definition of cheating

    "To violate rules deliberately, as in a game: was accused of cheating at cards."

    Exactly what Suarez did.

    In just about any other sport the goal would have counted anyway.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:32 am

    Wow. 4 goals from a couple of years ago? Well done. He's a hit and hope merchant. The dip on the ball comes from the positioning of the ball and kicking through the valve. It was perfected by this man:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuKIWfg_j1U. Those are free kicks taken properly. Ronaldo has taken his technique but fails miserably at it 9 times out of 10.

    The rest of your post is comical nonsense.

    Messi has scored less than Ronaldo in the past because he's a creator rather than a selfish player like Ronaldo. This season he is easily ahead of Ronaldo in both categories because he's better at both. You claimed Ronaldo was more complete and tried to use golden boot to prove it. Comical argument. And pointless because Messi has one won it and is on track to win it again this year. Henrik Larsson is not the only player in scotland to win the golden boot. Ally McCoist won it. twice. And Brian Laudrup is the best player to ever play in Scotland.

    Ronaldo plays as a winger for Real and has countless opportunities to shoot from distance, but his shooting is not great. Hence he has not 200 shots that have not resulted in goals.

    Coentrao is more complete than Vidic? What are you talking about. 1 is a centre back, 1 is a fullback converted from a winger. They play completely different positions! Ronaldo and Messi plays similar positions.

    When Ronaldo was Messi's age, he was just leaving United. Messi is so much better than the United-era Ronaldo it's untrue. He's also far better than the current version despite Ronaldo being in his peak years and Messi still being a few years away from them.

    Career stats set Messi far apart from Ronaldo, despite being so much younger.

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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  efils_god on Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:21 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:It's not cheating. Breaking the rules knowing you are going to get caught is not cheating. His team gained no advantage. They were in a worse situation after his handball than before it.

    I would defend ANY player who did what Suarez did. Any player who wouldn't do it has no business being a professional.

    I agree with you that any player should and probably would do the same in Suarez's position. But obviously the reason he did it was to gain an advantage, otherwise what's the point? Without an 'advantage' to gain he'd never have done it! Picking the ball up in the centre circle would be a hand ball without an advantage.

    The advantage he gained was it was pretty much the last minute of the game, if he didn't do it, his team were out, if he did, there is a slim chance they will go through.

    While i would do the same if i was in his position, he clearly gained an advantage for his team.

    (and obviously it is cheating, but anyone who says he should have let it go in is silly. If you think it should have been a goal anyway, then blame the rules, not Suarez. If it was in the rules that stopping the ball with your hand on the line resulted in a goal anyway he'd never have done it.)
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    manschesthair_utd
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  manschesthair_utd on Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:29 am

    Anfields5thKing wrote:It's not cheating. Breaking the rules knowing you are going to get caught is not cheating. His team gained no advantage. They were in a worse situation after his handball than before it.

    sometimes i think you just argue for the sake of it even when you are clearly wrong.
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  ChelseaQuinsfan on Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:18 pm

    Anfields5thKing wrote:Wow. 4 goals from a couple of years ago? Well done. He's a hit and hope merchant. The dip on the ball comes from the positioning of the ball and kicking through the valve. It was perfected by this man:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuKIWfg_j1U. Those are free kicks taken properly. Ronaldo has taken his technique but fails miserably at it 9 times out of 10.

    The rest of your post is comical nonsense.

    Messi has scored less than Ronaldo in the past because he's a creator rather than a selfish player like Ronaldo. This season he is easily ahead of Ronaldo in both categories because he's better at both. You claimed Ronaldo was more complete and tried to use golden boot to prove it. Comical argument. And pointless because Messi has one won it and is on track to win it again this year. Henrik Larsson is not the only player in scotland to win the golden boot. Ally McCoist won it. twice. And Brian Laudrup is the best player to ever play in Scotland.

    Ronaldo plays as a winger for Real and has countless opportunities to shoot from distance, but his shooting is not great. Hence he has not 200 shots that have not resulted in goals.

    Coentrao is more complete than Vidic? What are you talking about. 1 is a centre back, 1 is a fullback converted from a winger. They play completely different positions! Ronaldo and Messi plays similar positions.

    When Ronaldo was Messi's age, he was just leaving United. Messi is so much better than the United-era Ronaldo it's untrue. He's also far better than the current version despite Ronaldo being in his peak years and Messi still being a few years away from them.

    Career stats set Messi far apart from Ronaldo, despite being so much younger.


    The goal against Bosnia was quite recent. Anyway it doesn't matter when he took them, the fact is he did it and I can show you more recent examples. Juhninio is the greatest free kick taker ever, he's better than Ronaldo and Messi combined. No one in the current game even comes close to him so ofc players will try copy his style. Drogba has tried to copy the technique multiple times. The fact that Ronaldo attempts to copy the technique shows he isn't a hit and hope merchant because it's one of the hardest way to hit a free kick. In fact, if he was a hit and hope merchant he would probably be more successful because he has incredible power.

    Ronaldo is a creator as well hence all the assists he has for both Utd and Madrid. He was more of a creator at Real Madrid when he had Rooney alongside him. Anyway Messi is the better creator, for me that's clear and that's not what I'm arguing. This season Ronaldo has more goals in the league and he still has time to win it. I didn't use the golden boot to prove Ronaldo was the more complete player, I used it to prove he was the better goal scorer which he is. To score more goals than you have appearances in La Liga is just unbelievable, especially when he isn't even a striker. He's won it twice in two different leagues and each time he won it he was playing in the best league in the world.

    Sorry you are right about McCoist, but he is one of the best players to ever play in Scotland as well. The Scottish league was also stronger in his day. Laudrup is probably the best player to play in Scotland but he was already long established before he came and he only spent 3 seasons. Larsson IMO was more influential in Scotland. Gascoigne is a better player than Larsson as well but no one other player can replicate the dynasty Larsson created at Celtic. In Scotland, Larsson was better than Laudrup and everyone else.

    He plays as a striker as well and has played their countless times. He's played their at times ahead of the established strikers. The way Madrid play restricts his ability to shoot from distance. Either way Ronaldo is clearly better at shooting from distance than Messi.

    It's just an example, but a pretty dumb one I must admit. Ok, O Shea and Ferdinand are both more complete footballers than Vidic but neither are even close to his level. Having more attributes your games doesn't necessarily make you a better player, it makes you more versatile and that's not always the best thing.

    Ronaldo is 2-3 years older than Messi, the age difference isn't huge. The United version of Ronaldo was a magnificent player as well, not as good as Messi but still far better than any other player in the world. He didn't score as many goals but his all round game was sensational.

    Messi is the best player in the world, Ronaldo second and when fit Inieta is third but by some distance.



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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:02 pm

    efils_god wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:It's not cheating. Breaking the rules knowing you are going to get caught is not cheating. His team gained no advantage. They were in a worse situation after his handball than before it.

    I would defend ANY player who did what Suarez did. Any player who wouldn't do it has no business being a professional.

    I agree with you that any player should and probably would do the same in Suarez's position. But obviously the reason he did it was to gain an advantage, otherwise what's the point? Without an 'advantage' to gain he'd never have done it! Picking the ball up in the centre circle would be a hand ball without an advantage.

    The advantage he gained was it was pretty much the last minute of the game, if he didn't do it, his team were out, if he did, there is a slim chance they will go through.

    While i would do the same if i was in his position, he clearly gained an advantage for his team.

    (and obviously it is cheating, but anyone who says he should have let it go in is silly. If you think it should have been a goal anyway, then blame the rules, not Suarez. If it was in the rules that stopping the ball with your hand on the line resulted in a goal anyway he'd never have done it.)

    Gained no advantage. They were in a worse situation than they were before he handled the ball. Something not happening is not gaining an advantage.
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    Re: Football discussion

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:35 pm

    ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:
    Anfields5thKing wrote:Wow. 4 goals from a couple of years ago? Well done. He's a hit and hope merchant. The dip on the ball comes from the positioning of the ball and kicking through the valve. It was perfected by this man:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuKIWfg_j1U. Those are free kicks taken properly. Ronaldo has taken his technique but fails miserably at it 9 times out of 10.

    The rest of your post is comical nonsense.

    Messi has scored less than Ronaldo in the past because he's a creator rather than a selfish player like Ronaldo. This season he is easily ahead of Ronaldo in both categories because he's better at both. You claimed Ronaldo was more complete and tried to use golden boot to prove it. Comical argument. And pointless because Messi has one won it and is on track to win it again this year. Henrik Larsson is not the only player in scotland to win the golden boot. Ally McCoist won it. twice. And Brian Laudrup is the best player to ever play in Scotland.

    Ronaldo plays as a winger for Real and has countless opportunities to shoot from distance, but his shooting is not great. Hence he has not 200 shots that have not resulted in goals.

    Coentrao is more complete than Vidic? What are you talking about. 1 is a centre back, 1 is a fullback converted from a winger. They play completely different positions! Ronaldo and Messi plays similar positions.

    When Ronaldo was Messi's age, he was just leaving United. Messi is so much better than the United-era Ronaldo it's untrue. He's also far better than the current version despite Ronaldo being in his peak years and Messi still being a few years away from them.

    Career stats set Messi far apart from Ronaldo, despite being so much younger.


    The goal against Bosnia was quite recent. Anyway it doesn't matter when he took them, the fact is he did it and I can show you more recent examples. Juhninio is the greatest free kick taker ever, he's better than Ronaldo and Messi combined. No one in the current game even comes close to him so ofc players will try copy his style. Drogba has tried to copy the technique multiple times. The fact that Ronaldo attempts to copy the technique shows he isn't a hit and hope merchant because it's one of the hardest way to hit a free kick. In fact, if he was a hit and hope merchant he would probably be more successful because he has incredible power.

    Ronaldo is a creator as well hence all the assists he has for both Utd and Madrid. He was more of a creator at Real Madrid when he had Rooney alongside him. Anyway Messi is the better creator, for me that's clear and that's not what I'm arguing. This season Ronaldo has more goals in the league and he still has time to win it. I didn't use the golden boot to prove Ronaldo was the more complete player, I used it to prove he was the better goal scorer which he is. To score more goals than you have appearances in La Liga is just unbelievable, especially when he isn't even a striker. He's won it twice in two different leagues and each time he won it he was playing in the best league in the world.

    Sorry you are right about McCoist, but he is one of the best players to ever play in Scotland as well. The Scottish league was also stronger in his day. Laudrup is probably the best player to play in Scotland but he was already long established before he came and he only spent 3 seasons. Larsson IMO was more influential in Scotland. Gascoigne is a better player than Larsson as well but no one other player can replicate the dynasty Larsson created at Celtic. In Scotland, Larsson was better than Laudrup and everyone else.

    He plays as a striker as well and has played their countless times. He's played their at times ahead of the established strikers. The way Madrid play restricts his ability to shoot from distance. Either way Ronaldo is clearly better at shooting from distance than Messi.

    It's just an example, but a pretty dumb one I must admit. Ok, O Shea and Ferdinand are both more complete footballers than Vidic but neither are even close to his level. Having more attributes your games doesn't necessarily make you a better player, it makes you more versatile and that's not always the best thing.

    Ronaldo is 2-3 years older than Messi, the age difference isn't huge. The United version of Ronaldo was a magnificent player as well, not as good as Messi but still far better than any other player in the world. He didn't score as many goals but his all round game was sensational.

    Messi is the best player in the world, Ronaldo second and when fit Inieta is third but by some distance.




    Iniesta is better than Ronaldo. Superior all round player, also performs on the big stage whilst Ronaldo chokes constantly under pressure.


    That is a big age difference in football. An average career is 12 years at the highest level, Ronaldo is 1/4 of the way further through his career and Messi is vastly superior and has accomplished far more than Ronaldo. Messi could retire now and it's unlikely Ronaldo would match his achievements.


    I stopped reading at "O'Shea".

    Never plays as a striker for Real. Has been left wing since the day he arrived. Higuain and Benzema are always upfront and Real never play with 2 strikers. Di Maria-Ozil-Ronaldo or Ozil-Kaka-Ronaldo has been the constant attacking midfield trio.

    When Laudrup was at Rangers he was on another level to everyone in the league, just like Larsson. Their performances in Scotland were about on a par, but overall Laudrup was the better player. That being said, Henrik Larsson is the best striker to ever play there and arguably the biggest bargain in football history. 700k for that level of talent? You'd never see that today. Shame he didn't move to England in his prime.

    Ronaldo only passes when he has no chance to shoot. Only twice in his career has he managed 10 or more league assists in a season. He's got far better team-mates now than he did at United yet his assist numbers are very poor. Messi is on course for his fifth season of 10 or more in a row. Ronaldo has played 2 seasons more than Messi as well which shows just how big the gulf is. Ronaldo is 2 goals ahead of Messi in the league this season having played a game more. Given that two of his team-mates are the top creators in the league, that's not surprising. As for the comical claim that Ronaldo is the better goalscorer, look at their career stats.

    Messi is far more prolific. His career goals per game record is better than Ronaldo's. 450 club games and 249 goals for Ronaldo. 312 club games for Messi, 230 goals. It really isn't close. And then there's the shots to goals facts. Last season, just as example, Ronaldo scored 53 club goals. He needed 323 shots to do so. Messi also scored 53 club goals last season. He needed only 229 shots to do so. Same number of goals, 94 shots less. This season he has 50 from 191. Ronaldo has 44 goals from 242.

    He's a hit and hope merchant and striking a ball that way, when you practice it, isn't all that much harder than taking free kicks normally according to Juninho himself. Ronaldo doesn't use the actual kicking technique of Juninho. He seems to be under the illusion that it's all about kicking the ball as hard as he can. Juninho didn't kick at anything close to full power unless he was 35 yards or more out. Ronaldo stole the ball placement and the idea and tries to replicate the technique but he's awful at it because unlike Juninho he doesn't spend hours per day practicing and he tries to kick too hard. Messi also spends hours per day practicing his technique, Ronaldo doesn't bother. Like I said 50 free kicks this season, no goals. His attempts to goal record from free kicks throughout the last 5 years is nothing short of appalling.

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