Hatsu Hioki Signs with the UFC - Jose Aldo, You are on Notice

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:The last three strikes missed. Clearly. You've never seen anyone get punched in the face close up if you think they landed.

Sonnen would destroy anyone at 170. It would be a massacre. Hendo would knock them all clean out.GSP ran away from Shields guard. He knocked him down, thought about following him to the ground, shit his pants and ran away.

Nothing in your post was fact.

And yes, Fedor's list is FAR more impressive and against FAR tougher opposition than GSPs. 6 wins against former world champions, 7 if you include CroCop - a win that easily top anything GSP has done. 9 if you want to include the two K1 champs he's beaten. 10 if you include Arona's Rings title. His unbeaten run is the greatest in the history of the sport. GSP's list doesn't come close. Just as he doesn't come close.

Don't see either of those things happening. Henderson has a history of being taken down and controlled by far inferior wrestlers than those populating the welterweight division.

How much of Chael Sonnen's success comes from being a better wrestler than his contemporaries? How many great wrestlers has he actually beaten? Okami? Miller? Prangley?

How would he fare against a Koscheck? GSP? Fitch? Shields? Any wrestling advantage Sonnen enjoys at middleweight would be be drastically reduced at welterweight, and that's not even taking into account how much more generally skilled the welterweight division has been in comparrison to 185.

The only fighters at 170 with wrestling ability that comes close to Sonnen are Koscheck and Askren, and he's a better fighter than both. He has better striking and better head movement than either and his chin is one of the best in the sport.

Henderson has a history of being taken down by people bigger than him. He also has a history of knocking people out. Hendo was destroying Shields until his back went and he gassed. And inferior wrestlers to those populating the WW division? Such as???

Cowboys From Hell wrote:I thought this was a thread about Hioki in the UFC.

ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:

ChelseaQuinsfan wrote:Look at those pics again, you can actually see GSP's hands touching Alves's face!

Sonnen would destroy anyone at 170, is that a joke? The overrating of this guy since the Silva fight has become laughable. The man could barely last a round against ol'Jeremy Horn and was finished 3 times by him!

Hendo would get beaten by the majority of the top WWs.

GSP knocked him down and hesitated with the follow up, a wise move considering that was Shields only chance of winning. Only a dumb ass would have jumped into Shields guard at the that point.

Nearly everything I stated was fact. About Silva not finishing opponents, GSP's opponents ect.

GSP's level of wins is far better. Not only has he beaten more top 10 fighters in a better division as well, he's also beaten more top P4P fighters as well. K-1 titles mean nothing in MMA, Cro Cop never held a belt, and we all know what happened against Arona. GSP's list of wins is far and a away the more impressive list.

First of the final 3 is a right hand that misses, Alves blocked it.
Second is a left hook that clearly misses Alves.
The Final picture looks like he is attempt to penetrate Alves. No strike being thrown.

I know you don't watch MMA but you should go back and watch the three Sonnen-Horn fights. Sonnen was easily winning them all. He made two mistakes and got caught in submissions by one of the best submission artists in the sport. Barely last a round?? What are you talking about?? The last of those fights was 5 years ago. No bearing on Sonnen today.

Hendo would walk through most WWs and beat the rest.

He knocked him down, got scared and ran from confrontation. Usual GSP tactic.

Nothing you said was fact, just your usual bullshit.

We do know what happened, it was a close fight between two young fighters that Fedor won. Very simple. CroCop won the Pride OpenWeight GrandPrix and in doing so, won himself a belt.
K1 titles mean nothing? Except for the fact they prove you are a truly top class striker. Schilt might be the best K1 fighter ever. And K1 and MMA have a lot of similarities. Of course, since you watch neither, you wouldn't know that.

What P4P fighters has GSP beaten?? Shields and ???. His cheating against BJ doesn't count as a win. If he wasn't the Golden Boy, he'd have been disqualified. Fedor beat Nog - twice, and CroCop. Both of whom have been in the top 5 P4P in their careers. GSP has no top 5 p4p wins. Less wins against top talent, nothing close to the win streak. Oh, and nothing close to the amount of finishes. GSP has NINE decisions in his 22 wins, Fedor has only 7 in his 31. 3 years, and 6 fights since he finished anyone. And 90% of Fedor's fights were against bigger opponents. GSP is nearly always bigger than his opponent. GSP is also a proven cheat. Fedor's record is better, his list of wins is better, his legacy is far more impressive, and P4P he's simply a much better fighter.

Oh ok I get it, your just delusional.

SOnnen got owned by Horn 3 times, finished all 3 times and couldn't even get out of the first round twice.

Hendo would get beaten very easily by the top WWs, would barely be competitive.

Only morons jump into black belts gaurds.

Everything I stated was an actual fact, but since your ANfield, Fact doesn't apply.

Actually it was very clear to nearly everyone that Arona won that fight, but RINGS judging is corrupted. Come on grand master Anfield, you of all people should know tournament wins aren't the same as titles. And stop changing my words. K-1 titles mean nothing in MMA. I love K-1 and watch it all the time, but success in K-1 does not mean success in MMA. Have a look at Badr Hari for example. Schilt one of the greatest of all time in K-1 had a pretty average career in MMA.

GSP has wins over Shields, HUghes 2x, BJ (lets count the first time) and Fitch. Thats more P4P wins than Fedor and he has far more top 10 wins than Fedor ever has. And GSP has fought less as well. More top 10 wins in less fights and certainly more talented opponents. While it's true Fedor has more finishes, thats very easy when your fighting the likes of MArk Hunt, Zulu and Hong Man-Choi. Fedor's best wins are Cro Cop and Big Nog Twice. Couldn't finish them and if he fought that level of competition more he would have a lot more decisions as well. GSP has the most impressive list of wins ever, is the best P4P fighter and could very well go down as the greatest of all time.

Cowboys From Hell wrote:I thought this was a thread about Hioki in the UFC.

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:The last three strikes missed. Clearly. You've never seen anyone get punched in the face close up if you think they landed.

Sonnen would destroy anyone at 170. It would be a massacre. Hendo would knock them all clean out.GSP ran away from Shields guard. He knocked him down, thought about following him to the ground, shit his pants and ran away.

Nothing in your post was fact.

And yes, Fedor's list is FAR more impressive and against FAR tougher opposition than GSPs. 6 wins against former world champions, 7 if you include CroCop - a win that easily top anything GSP has done. 9 if you want to include the two K1 champs he's beaten. 10 if you include Arona's Rings title. His unbeaten run is the greatest in the history of the sport. GSP's list doesn't come close. Just as he doesn't come close.

Don't see either of those things happening. Henderson has a history of being taken down and controlled by far inferior wrestlers than those populating the welterweight division.

How much of Chael Sonnen's success comes from being a better wrestler than his contemporaries? How many great wrestlers has he actually beaten? Okami? Miller? Prangley?

How would he fare against a Koscheck? GSP? Fitch? Shields? Any wrestling advantage Sonnen enjoys at middleweight would be be drastically reduced at welterweight, and that's not even taking into account how much more generally skilled the welterweight division has been in comparrison to 185.

The only fighters at 170 with wrestling ability that comes close to Sonnen are Koscheck and Askren, and he's a better fighter than both. He has better striking and better head movement than either and his chin is one of the best in the sport.

Henderson has a history of being taken down by people bigger than him. He also has a history of knocking people out. Hendo was destroying Shields until his back went and he gassed. And inferior wrestlers to those populating the WW division? Such as???

Koscheck and Askren on paper. I wouldn't be shocked if practically speaking, Fitch, Shields, GSP, Prime Hughes all held their own against Sonnen. Plus Sonnen has far worse submission defense than any of them. There's no basis for saying Sonnen would run through welterweight when he fights in a division so empty of great wrestlers.

Henderson taken down by people bigger than him? Like Carlos Newton? Ninja? Bustamante? Yuki Kondo? Misaki? Akira Shoji? Shields? All took down Henderson and held him down for lengths of time in their fights. All are natural welterweights/at best average sized middleweights, and none of those guys have wrestling as good as the top welterweight wrestlers.

The revisionist history of Hendersons career is pretty funny. Before 2007 he was basically seen as a wildly inconsistant fighter. Looked great knocking out Japanese welterweights but extremely lucky to get the nod in a lot of his big wins. He'd struggle if he were a welterweight.

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:The last three strikes missed. Clearly. You've never seen anyone get punched in the face close up if you think they landed.

Sonnen would destroy anyone at 170. It would be a massacre. Hendo would knock them all clean out.GSP ran away from Shields guard. He knocked him down, thought about following him to the ground, shit his pants and ran away.

Nothing in your post was fact.

And yes, Fedor's list is FAR more impressive and against FAR tougher opposition than GSPs. 6 wins against former world champions, 7 if you include CroCop - a win that easily top anything GSP has done. 9 if you want to include the two K1 champs he's beaten. 10 if you include Arona's Rings title. His unbeaten run is the greatest in the history of the sport. GSP's list doesn't come close. Just as he doesn't come close.

Don't see either of those things happening. Henderson has a history of being taken down and controlled by far inferior wrestlers than those populating the welterweight division.

How much of Chael Sonnen's success comes from being a better wrestler than his contemporaries? How many great wrestlers has he actually beaten? Okami? Miller? Prangley?

How would he fare against a Koscheck? GSP? Fitch? Shields? Any wrestling advantage Sonnen enjoys at middleweight would be be drastically reduced at welterweight, and that's not even taking into account how much more generally skilled the welterweight division has been in comparrison to 185.

The only fighters at 170 with wrestling ability that comes close to Sonnen are Koscheck and Askren, and he's a better fighter than both. He has better striking and better head movement than either and his chin is one of the best in the sport.

Henderson has a history of being taken down by people bigger than him. He also has a history of knocking people out. Hendo was destroying Shields until his back went and he gassed. And inferior wrestlers to those populating the WW division? Such as???

Koscheck and Askren on paper. I wouldn't be shocked if practically speaking, Fitch, Shields, GSP, Prime Hughes all held their own against Sonnen. Plus Sonnen has far worse submission defense than any of them. There's no basis for saying Sonnen would run through welterweight when he fights in a division so empty of great wrestlers.

Henderson taken down by people bigger than him? Like Carlos Newton? Ninja? Bustamante? Yuki Kondo? Misaki? Akira Shoji? Shields? All took down Henderson and held him down for lengths of time in their fights. All are natural welterweights/at best average sized middleweights, and none of those guys have wrestling as good as the top welterweight wrestlers.

The revisionist history of Hendersons career is pretty funny. Before 2007 he was basically seen as a wildly inconsistant fighter. Looked great knocking out Japanese welterweights but extremely lucky to get the nod in a lot of his big wins. He'd struggle if he were a welterweight.

Practically speaking GSP is a poor wrestler with good takedowns. Fitch, Shields and Hughes aren't close to Sonnen as a wrestler.

Ninja, Kondo and Bustamante are all bigger than Hendo. Shoji is shorter but stockier. He's fought at HW multiple times. None of these fighters are WW's. Same goes Misaki. Hendo was a pretty average sized MW. He's now a very small LHW.

Newton vs Henderson was at the start of both of there careers. Both took each other down for extended periods. He was destroying Shields until his back went.

"The revisionist history of Hendersons career is pretty funny". You're right, you should stop attempting to do so. "Before 2007 he was basically seen as a wildly inconsistant fighter. Looked great knocking out Japanese welterweights but extremely lucky to get the nod in a lot of his big wins." is a statement worthy of a MikeyBoyBisping award. Comical nonsense. Up until 2007, Misaki was the only questionable loss on his record.

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:

sunthunder wrote:

Anfields5thKing wrote:The last three strikes missed. Clearly. You've never seen anyone get punched in the face close up if you think they landed.

Sonnen would destroy anyone at 170. It would be a massacre. Hendo would knock them all clean out.GSP ran away from Shields guard. He knocked him down, thought about following him to the ground, shit his pants and ran away.

Nothing in your post was fact.

And yes, Fedor's list is FAR more impressive and against FAR tougher opposition than GSPs. 6 wins against former world champions, 7 if you include CroCop - a win that easily top anything GSP has done. 9 if you want to include the two K1 champs he's beaten. 10 if you include Arona's Rings title. His unbeaten run is the greatest in the history of the sport. GSP's list doesn't come close. Just as he doesn't come close.

Don't see either of those things happening. Henderson has a history of being taken down and controlled by far inferior wrestlers than those populating the welterweight division.

How much of Chael Sonnen's success comes from being a better wrestler than his contemporaries? How many great wrestlers has he actually beaten? Okami? Miller? Prangley?

How would he fare against a Koscheck? GSP? Fitch? Shields? Any wrestling advantage Sonnen enjoys at middleweight would be be drastically reduced at welterweight, and that's not even taking into account how much more generally skilled the welterweight division has been in comparrison to 185.

The only fighters at 170 with wrestling ability that comes close to Sonnen are Koscheck and Askren, and he's a better fighter than both. He has better striking and better head movement than either and his chin is one of the best in the sport.

Henderson has a history of being taken down by people bigger than him. He also has a history of knocking people out. Hendo was destroying Shields until his back went and he gassed. And inferior wrestlers to those populating the WW division? Such as???

Koscheck and Askren on paper. I wouldn't be shocked if practically speaking, Fitch, Shields, GSP, Prime Hughes all held their own against Sonnen. Plus Sonnen has far worse submission defense than any of them. There's no basis for saying Sonnen would run through welterweight when he fights in a division so empty of great wrestlers.

Henderson taken down by people bigger than him? Like Carlos Newton? Ninja? Bustamante? Yuki Kondo? Misaki? Akira Shoji? Shields? All took down Henderson and held him down for lengths of time in their fights. All are natural welterweights/at best average sized middleweights, and none of those guys have wrestling as good as the top welterweight wrestlers.

The revisionist history of Hendersons career is pretty funny. Before 2007 he was basically seen as a wildly inconsistant fighter. Looked great knocking out Japanese welterweights but extremely lucky to get the nod in a lot of his big wins. He'd struggle if he were a welterweight.

Practically speaking GSP is a poor wrestler with good takedowns. Fitch, Shields and Hughes aren't close to Sonnen as a wrestler.

Ninja, Kondo and Bustamante are all bigger than Hendo. Shoji is shorter but stockier. He's fought at HW multiple times. None of these fighters are WW's. Same goes Misaki. Hendo was a pretty average sized MW. He's now a very small LHW.

Newton vs Henderson was at the start of both of there careers. Both took each other down for extended periods. He was destroying Shields until his back went.

"The revisionist history of Hendersons career is pretty funny". You're right, you should stop attempting to do so. "Before 2007 he was basically seen as a wildly inconsistant fighter. Looked great knocking out Japanese welterweights but extremely lucky to get the nod in a lot of his big wins." is a statement worthy of a MikeyBoyBisping award. Comical nonsense. Up until 2007, Misaki was the only questionable loss on his record.

Not really, Ninja was a fat light heavyweight, and a not especially ripped middleweight. Henderson has always been leaner and better conditioned than Ninja whatever weight they've been at. Kondo was soft even when coming down to middleweight. Bustamante is an average sized middleweight, he doesn't enjoy a size or power advantage over Henderson. Shoji is fat and 5'7. Misaki is a soft middleweight too, he could easily be at 170. You know he fought at lightweight as an amateur right?

Nothing you've said discredits that when you actually look at peoples reactions to Hendersons fights with Newton, Ninja, Kondo, Bustamante, the majority seem to agree that he didn't deserve those decisions. His nickname wasn't "Decision Dan" for nothing. And that's not my opinion of Henderson being inconsistent, that was a widely held view. No one wanted Henderson to face Wanderlei at Pride 33, no one was calling for it.

Why aren't GSP/Hughes/Shields close to Sonnen? I've seen them fight quality wrestlers at their own weight. We've seen Sonnen fight who? Okami? By your logic if pure wrestling pedigree was all that came into it than surely Henderson would never have been taken down by those fighters I listed? Surely none of those guys are "close to Henderson as a wrestler"?

You argue too much by just insisting things are true and throwing in insults. "Sonnen is better because he's better."