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    thoughts on condit v diaz

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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:51 pm

    i am backing condit this weekend wouldnt be suprised either way though interested to see if im on my own i know there is a lot of diaz love on here

    also fancy kos and werdum renan barao and ed herman
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:01 pm

    As much as I hate Diaz, his record is nothing short of phenomenal, I just cannot see Condit beating him, I seriously think that Diaz is as good as anyone out there, lethal standup and an awesome ground game.

    Looking forward to see whether Bruce Leroy looks as good as he did last time out. Other than that, a bit apathetic about most of the rest, although it could well turn out to be one of 'those' cards.
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    Post  rudeboyben84 Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:10 pm

    Yeah mate lot of love for Diaz on here, and 90% of it coming from me. I think he is unstoppable right now. Anyone with that sort of BJJ game than can go toe to toe with Paul Daley isnt loosing to someone like Condit. The only people who might beat Diaz are big wrestlers with the sole intention of trying to wrestlefuck him.

    Paul Daley, Robblie Lawler, Zaromskis, Penn, Cyborg, Gomi, Noons, Lytle, Neer, He beat them all. No striker is going to best Diaz on the feet in the devision. Condit wont sub him either. His only chance if for Greg Jackson teaching him some stalling techniques and even then I dont see him fighting his fight against Diaz his Wrestling isnt that good.

    Werdum vs Nelson is a cracker but I think Werdum will show he is a top level rounder figther and beat Nelson standing. I dont think its a sure bet to be honest im 60/40 but Werdum has dealt with bigger stronger guys than Nelson and seems quick enough on the feet these days to outstrike Roy.

    Baron vs Jorgensen going to be a great one, I think Baron is a better Grappler overall and on the feet is a lot longer. Think Baron takes a tough fought decision.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:14 pm

    yeah i rate renan

    diaz has come on leaps and bounds i rate him highly too no way condit will stall he is very ecxiting could be an absolute cracker
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:14 pm

    Here's a question Ben, where does Diaz sit in this mythical list of P4P fighters? Where would he sit, with a win over Condit and then GSP? Got to be one of the best records in MMA at the moment? He's lost what? 2 fights in best part of 6years?
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:20 pm

    riggs sanchez sherk and karo dont forget many moons ago i know and same could be said about anderson

    lets see how he gets on this year if he beats condit and gsp or ellenberger

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    Post  The_Axe_Emperor Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:23 pm

    Gotta admit I wasnt that big on Nick until he fought BJ. His list of wins in strike force were mediocre save from say Daley and maybe Noons, but the way he beat down Penn was an eye opener. I'm still hesitant to back him as truly world class because it's clear that Penn isn't what he once was, but the only person that's beat down Penn like that is Frankie Edgar.

    That being said I don't think Cpndit is 'world class' either. He's pretty much the Welterweight version of Donald Cerrone, whereas Nick is obviously the Welterweight Nate Diaz. Therefore I'm going with the same result as Nate- Cerrone.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:26 pm

    nice comparison

    diaz beat him much worse that got my respect too
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:26 pm

    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:Gotta admit I wasnt that big on Nick until he fought BJ. His list of wins in strike force were mediocre save from say Daley and maybe Noons, but the way he beat down Penn was an eye opener. I'm still hesitant to back him as truly world class because it's clear that Penn isn't what he once was, but the only person that's beat down Penn like that is Frankie Edgar.

    That being said I don't think Cpndit is 'world class' either. He's pretty much the Welterweight version of Donald Cerrone, whereas Nick is obviously the Welterweight Nate Diaz. Therefore I'm going with the same result as Nate- Cerrone.

    Completely with you on Condit, although with regards to Cerrone, still think fight fatigue had an impact on the result.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:27 pm

    i disagree nate was the man
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    Post  rudeboyben84 Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:30 pm

    Pete It always recks my head to think about p4p lists because honestly I sometimes think a number 2 ranked guy like Diaz is better than some Champs in other weights.

    I couldnt be arsed trawling records but off the top of my head id say top 5.

    1. Anderson
    2. Jon Jones
    3. GSP
    4. Jose Aldo
    5. Nick Diaz

    Maby Hendo ahead of him if we are going in that he is a Mw who flattened Fedor like no one ever has...

    The thing is he lands the most punches of any MMA fighter, its a stat that speaks volumes for me, more than 135ers etc.. There is no one in MMA like him for Boxing skills. His defence isnt great but his Chin and heart have passed all sorts of tests.

    What about yourself?
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    Post  The_Axe_Emperor Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:31 pm

    Once Mohawked Pete wrote:
    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:Gotta admit I wasnt that big on Nick until he fought BJ. His list of wins in strike force were mediocre save from say Daley and maybe Noons, but the way he beat down Penn was an eye opener. I'm still hesitant to back him as truly world class because it's clear that Penn isn't what he once was, but the only person that's beat down Penn like that is Frankie Edgar.

    That being said I don't think Cpndit is 'world class' either. He's pretty much the Welterweight version of Donald Cerrone, whereas Nick is obviously the Welterweight Nate Diaz. Therefore I'm going with the same result as Nate- Cerrone.

    Completely with you on Condit, although with regards to Cerrone, still think fight fatigue had an impact on the result.

    I don't think it was fatigue so much as Nate was just in his head. You could see from the opening bell Cerrone looked furious and just came out like your average Joe on a Saturday night and just tried to finish Nate there and then.
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:33 pm

    2brutal wrote:i disagree nate was the man

    I suppose that's something that we'll never really know. I just think that he had a couple too many fights in too short a timeframe. There is no doubt though, that Nate destroyed him, Cerrone just looked way off the pace, I'm aware that it may well have been because of the pressure that Nate put him under, wouldn't mind seeing a rematch sometime in the future though.

    And yeah, it may well have been because Nate 'got in his head', don't think he'd be the first fighter to suffer from that.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:35 pm

    he sure did fight alot last year cerrone
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:42 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:Pete It always recks my head to think about p4p lists because honestly I sometimes think a number 2 ranked guy like Diaz is better than some Champs in other weights.

    I couldnt be arsed trawling records but off the top of my head id say top 5.

    1. Anderson
    2. Jon Jones
    3. GSP
    4. Jose Aldo
    5. Nick Diaz

    Maby Hendo ahead of him if we are going in that he is a Mw who flattened Fedor like no one ever has...

    The thing is he lands the most punches of any MMA fighter, its a stat that speaks volumes for me, more than 135ers etc.. There is no one in MMA like him for Boxing skills. His defence isnt great but his Chin and heart have passed all sorts of tests.

    What about yourself?

    Again, I find it really difficult to think of these lists, hence my lack of contribution to the 'top 10' lists on here, but if I were pushed, I'd have the following -

    1. A.Silva
    2. GSP
    3. Aldo
    4. Jones
    5. Diaz/Edgar

    Most of these are based purely on length unbeaten, standard of fighters fought, and if they were all the same weight and size, who would win. Silva (with the exception of the Sonnen fight) has looked unbeatable in his title fights. GSP (whilst fighting safe) has also looked untouchable (although I do expect Diaz to push him further than anyone else). Aldo has gassed and obviously has had his issues with cutting weight, but has an equally great looking record. Jones has shown huge improvement fight by fight, and has beaten some very notable names, but has a bit to go yet.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:47 pm

    jones
    anderson
    gsp
    edgar
    aldo
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:51 pm

    2brutal wrote:jones
    anderson
    gsp
    edgar
    aldo

    Really? Jones at No1? I certainly feel that he has the ability, and obviously age is on his side, but, not too sure. I know that P4P lists are very subjective, but, is it not too soon to have Jones as P4P No1?
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:54 pm

    probably but 2011

    4 stoppages

    bader
    shogun
    rampage
    machida

    not easy too finishsome of them pretty impressive imo gsp ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:57 pm

    2brutal wrote:probably but 2011

    4 stoppages

    bader
    shogun
    rampage
    machida

    not easy too finishsome of them pretty impressive imo gsp ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud ud

    There's no doubt that, last year was definitely Jones's, but I'm just wary about building up fighters, based on such a short period of time. I also think that Machida, demonstrated that there are chinks in his stand-up game.
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    Post  2brutal Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:59 pm

    time will tell i think he took a big shot well which was one of my doubts he did better than my mate cain
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:04 pm

    2brutal wrote:time will tell i think he took a big shot well which was one of my doubts he did better than my mate cain

    Yup, although the JDS punch caught him right on the temple, it knocked his balance all to cock (as it would have most HWs), looking forward to seeing whether Cain can get a decent run together now, some mouth-watering fights in store for him surely. Werdum and Carwin spring immediately to mind, and would love to see either JDS Part II or Overoid.
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    Post  rudeboyben84 Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:21 pm

    Once Mohawked Pete wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:Pete It always recks my head to think about p4p lists because honestly I sometimes think a number 2 ranked guy like Diaz is better than some Champs in other weights.

    I couldnt be arsed trawling records but off the top of my head id say top 5.

    1. Anderson
    2. Jon Jones
    3. GSP
    4. Jose Aldo
    5. Nick Diaz

    Maby Hendo ahead of him if we are going in that he is a Mw who flattened Fedor like no one ever has...

    The thing is he lands the most punches of any MMA fighter, its a stat that speaks volumes for me, more than 135ers etc.. There is no one in MMA like him for Boxing skills. His defence isnt great but his Chin and heart have passed all sorts of tests.

    What about yourself?

    Again, I find it really difficult to think of these lists, hence my lack of contribution to the 'top 10' lists on here, but if I were pushed, I'd have the following -

    1. A.Silva
    2. GSP
    3. Aldo
    4. Jones
    5. Diaz/Edgar

    Most of these are based purely on length unbeaten, standard of fighters fought, and if they were all the same weight and size, who would win. Silva (with the exception of the Sonnen fight) has looked unbeatable in his title fights. GSP (whilst fighting safe) has also looked untouchable (although I do expect Diaz to push him further than anyone else). Aldo has gassed and obviously has had his issues with cutting weight, but has an equally great looking record. Jones has shown huge improvement fight by fight, and has beaten some very notable names, but has a bit to go yet.

    Yeah Edgar does get overlooked, on paper I suppose you can say Edgar is better than Diaz but when you watch them both Diaz had his way with Penn, I think Edgar went 1-1 with him. You look at Maynard who is a close fight for Diaz' wee brother and he knocked Edgar silly and has an even record with Edgar. Stick Nate in with Edgar and id back him to come away with a win. Nate is bigger and throws about 1.5 the amount of strikes, I say you stick a 6"5 265lbs Edgar in there and Nick still kicks his balls in! Laughing

    If he beats Bendo im sold on him but right now I think there are a handfull of guys who can and would beat him...

    Again maby its because he is in the tought weight class. But fair call.

    If the size thing comes into P4P Hendo has to be in there. There are Ww's bigger than him!
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:27 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:
    Once Mohawked Pete wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:Pete It always recks my head to think about p4p lists because honestly I sometimes think a number 2 ranked guy like Diaz is better than some Champs in other weights.

    I couldnt be arsed trawling records but off the top of my head id say top 5.

    1. Anderson
    2. Jon Jones
    3. GSP
    4. Jose Aldo
    5. Nick Diaz

    Maby Hendo ahead of him if we are going in that he is a Mw who flattened Fedor like no one ever has...

    The thing is he lands the most punches of any MMA fighter, its a stat that speaks volumes for me, more than 135ers etc.. There is no one in MMA like him for Boxing skills. His defence isnt great but his Chin and heart have passed all sorts of tests.

    What about yourself?

    Again, I find it really difficult to think of these lists, hence my lack of contribution to the 'top 10' lists on here, but if I were pushed, I'd have the following -

    1. A.Silva
    2. GSP
    3. Aldo
    4. Jones
    5. Diaz/Edgar

    Most of these are based purely on length unbeaten, standard of fighters fought, and if they were all the same weight and size, who would win. Silva (with the exception of the Sonnen fight) has looked unbeatable in his title fights. GSP (whilst fighting safe) has also looked untouchable (although I do expect Diaz to push him further than anyone else). Aldo has gassed and obviously has had his issues with cutting weight, but has an equally great looking record. Jones has shown huge improvement fight by fight, and has beaten some very notable names, but has a bit to go yet.

    Yeah Edgar does get overlooked, on paper I suppose you can say Edgar is better than Diaz but when you watch them both Diaz had his way with Penn, I think Edgar went 1-1 with him. You look at Maynard who is a close fight for Diaz' wee brother and he knocked Edgar silly and has an even record with Edgar. Stick Nate in with Edgar and id back him to come away with a win. Nate is bigger and throws about 1.5 the amount of strikes, I say you stick a 6"5 265lbs Edgar in there and Nick still kicks his balls in! Laughing

    If he beats Bendo im sold on him but right now I think there are a handfull of guys who can and would beat him...

    Again maby its because he is in the tought weight class. But fair call.

    If the size thing comes into P4P Hendo has to be in there. There are Ww's bigger than him!

    Agreed about Hendo, but I cannot help but think his best days are well gone. Don't get me wrong, that right hand could flatten almost anyone, but at the moment, I'd have him just outside top5. With regards to the Diaz/Edgar/Penn debate, Penn is a far better fighter at LW (IMO) than at WW, and had Edgar been a little bit more clinical in the 2nd fight, I think we would have had a stoppage there. I think it would be an interesting fight, if Nick and Edgar were in the same weight division, Edgar's power of recovery are unbelievable.
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    Post  Once Mohawked Pete Sun Feb 05, 2012 4:50 pm

    Spoiler:
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    Post  2brutal Sun Feb 05, 2012 5:00 pm

    48/27 thats a bit wide

    yeah i had it to diaz by 1 as well mate close fight hope he doesnt retire

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