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    Return of the brothers Nogueira

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    rudeboyben84
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    Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Wed Oct 12, 2011 3:57 pm

    So the Nogueira brothers in all likelyhood will be going in to their next fights as underdogs. Tito being ranked again after beating Bader and Mir having a head to head win over Nog.

    I have Little hope Nog has changed his game or recovered enough to make the fight with the much bigger quicker Mir any different this time around. Though Mir hasnt the best Chin and he did KO Schaub standing. Despite this I reckon Nog needs to capitalise on Mir's relatively weak TDD and get this one to the groud where I give him the advantage. I see him trading strikes and getting KO'd again.

    Lil Nog is in with his 4th straight wrestler, He Scraped a win over Brilz and gave Bader a 50/50 fight then was dominated by Phil Davis. Lil Nog isnt the most Physical Lhw and in a way is like the Diaz brothers, dangerous Subs and Hands but a bit lacking in the Wrestling department so Wrestlers are going to cause him problems... I dont know wether Tito will though. After 3 straight fights against Wrestlers he has spend a lot of time drilling his TDD, Tito isnt as quick as he once was and has more confidence in his standup. I think Nog will soundly outstrike him but I cant see Tito getting happed from top position on the ground.

    Im going for KO by Mir and either KO or UD for Lil Nog, though it would make my night come UFC 140 to see both guys getting their hands raised.
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    superman_punch
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  superman_punch on Wed Oct 12, 2011 4:52 pm

    I'm the opposite I wanna see Tito and Mir's hands raised. I can't see Big Nog beating Mir whereas Tito Lil Nog I could see it been a KO like you said for Lil Nog or a slow pace UD in Tito's favour. I just wanna see the grave digger celebration again.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Cowboys From Hell on Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:02 pm

    I see Mir knocking Nog out again and Tito decisioning Lil Nog.
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    Sheldan
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Sheldan on Wed Oct 12, 2011 5:28 pm

    Cowboys From Hell wrote:I see Mir knocking Nog out again and Tito decisioning Lil Nog.

    Ditto.
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    Anfields5thKing
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Anfields5thKing on Wed Oct 12, 2011 6:51 pm

    I've been thinking about these two fights and I really can't find any enthusiasm for either of them. Four guys who should retire and have no chance of ever being relevant again.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:03 pm

    I cannot abide Tito or Mir. I see Tito vs Lil Nog being relatively close, hopefully with Tito being beaten in the stand up.

    I see Mir vs Nog going the same was as the last fight, unfortunately. I can see where Anfield is coming from here though, cannot see either fight having too much relevance in their relative divisions. Sadly, I could see this paving the way for a title shot for Mir, where he will, hopefully get battered into oblivion.

    I see a UD for Lil Nog and an early-ish stoppage for Mir Sad
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    p4pnumber_1
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  p4pnumber_1 on Wed Oct 12, 2011 7:42 pm

    Sheldan wrote:
    Cowboys From Hell wrote:I see Mir knocking Nog out again and Tito decisioning Lil Nog.

    Ditto.

    That is also how I see the fights playing out.

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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  GSPfan11 on Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:15 pm

    Tito is my favourite fighter of all time but it's painful fo watch him fight now. If i was Titos opponent I'd just make sure i got out the 1st round as his gas tank is terrible now. He stands there hands raised over his forehead, gasping for air throwing a telegraphed right hand and going for a half hearted takedown when the right hand doesn't land.

    Mir to handle Nog easy, which will be sad as Mir is a dick and wouldn't have lived with Nog back in his pride days.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Mannpagejackson on Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:27 pm

    "Nogueira is still a very tough guy. A lot of people are on two sides of the extreme. They either think the first fight was a fluke or that he should retire. I see someone who is going to be extremely motivated who wants to get revenge, so I don't look to overlook him at all. He's a very legitimate submission specialist, obviously. Even when he's 80-years old he's gonna be dangerous on the ground. On our feet I feel I still have a very big advantage due to my athletic ability and I'm a little more fluid. Being on our feet is a great advantage for me and less risk of something bad happening there than on the ground."

    Mir feels he holds the advantage and ive gotta agree. But i think anfield has a point, 2 absolute nothing fights realistically. Only mir has any real chance of getting anywhere near a top heavyweight competitor any time soon. I think if/when overoids beats brock, ufc will probably give him mir to complete there trilogy. And i see mir losing again. Tito - was nice to see him dig some graves this year and based on that performance id have to back him against lil nog, but realistically, rashad beat him without breakin a sweat and lhw has plenty of challenges at the moment. So 2 good fights with former greats but realistically it is all irrelevant.
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    superman_punch
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  superman_punch on Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:44 pm

    Theses fights 7/8 years ago would have been huge. Nogueira brothers now move like zombies.

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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  2brutal on Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:43 am

    tito ud big nog ud
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    rudeboyben84
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:45 am

    Big Nog = The most disrespected fighter in MMA

    4-2 in the UFC, beat 2 Former champs, lost to 2 Former champs. Also beat 2 strong contenders.

    What other fighter goes 2-2 with Champ level fighters and 4-2 over all in the UFC and gains 0 respect in doing it. Not to mention he spend the guts of a decade as number 2 fighter before that!

    People say he is irrelevant or a Zombie and Mir will beat him easily. What about this, Schaub is every bit as good as striker and Nog KO'd him using upperbody movement and punching from Angles... not Zombieish at all.

    Saddens me to see them get so little respect and these fights called irrelevant when the winner of Nog vs Mir will be top 5 ranked in the UFC.
    -------------------------------------------------------

    Also for the record Lil Nog isnt slow at all. People forget he knocked BOTH Overeem and Shogun about on the feet in Pride. Sure that was a couple of years back but he hasnt half the Mileage on the clock his brother does.

    Tito fought Evans in a number 1 contenders fight and now he is Irrelevant? Fighting a BJJ BB who battered the best strikers in MMA on the feet... cant see how he can be irrelevant, Stick Nog in with Forrest or Rampage and id put big money on him taking him a win.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Cowboys From Hell on Thu Oct 13, 2011 12:13 pm

    I'll be honest Ben I think myself and probably many others overrated Schaub's striking and Nog still seems to have some miles left on his clock.

    I love Nog as much as the next Nog fan but I just Feel Mir's speed and striking are too much for him at this stage of his career I'll be honest I thought the first fight was mainly all down to the staph infection Nog had (It did play a role though) but after seeing the fight a few times It was clear Mir's speed and Combo's were too much for Nog.
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    rudeboyben84
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Thu Oct 13, 2011 12:40 pm

    Cowboys From Hell wrote:I'll be honest Ben I think myself and probably many others overrated Schaub's striking and Nog still seems to have some miles left on his clock.

    I love Nog as much as the next Nog fan but I just Feel Mir's speed and striking are too much for him at this stage of his career I'll be honest I thought the first fight was mainly all down to the staph infection Nog had (It did play a role though) but after seeing the fight a few times It was clear Mir's speed and Combo's were too much for Nog.

    Dont get me wrong mate Im backing Mir too, but Im shocked at some of the comments, compare Schaub and Mir's fights with Crocop... there isnt a big difference between them, power, speed and Chin wise and Nog came in to the Schaub fight with a totally different style of boxing (infact the boxing style looked a lot like Mir's) and got the job done on the feet

    Nog isnt the Zombie that walked into Sylvia jabs for 10 mins, you have to say his striking against Schaub looked as good as weve seen of him in years.

    I dont see him as a favorite to win but I dont see Mir winning as a sure bet. I reckon Nog gives him more trouble than most people on here think he will.

    Mir probabally has the advantage standing like you say his speed and combos will be the difference but we havnt seen them hit the matt and Grapple. Mir is nowhere near as strong as someone his weigh should be and isnt a good wrestler. If it hits the matt I reckon Nog is going to have the advantage.

    Reckon Nog can take Mir down?
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  The_Axe_Emperor on Thu Oct 13, 2011 1:10 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:Big Nog = The most disrespected fighter in MMA



    Nope, Ben, Frankie Edgar holds that title. Nog is a close second though.

    IMO however the Schaub KO was a fluke, he didn't look great at all in that fight, was getting tagged all night long.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Thu Oct 13, 2011 1:14 pm

    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:Big Nog = The most disrespected fighter in MMA



    Nope, Ben, Frankie Edgar holds that title. Nog is a close second though.

    IMO however the Schaub KO was a fluke, he didn't look great at all in that fight, was getting tagged all night long.

    Laughing Id agree, I havnt backed Edgar once in his last 4 fights I think!!

    Yeah Nog did get tagged a lot but Lawler got tagged a lot when he KO'd Manhoef, Kongo got tagged a lot when he KO'd Barry, whoever won by KO put on the better performance.

    He didnt look great but you have to say it was an improved performance considering he is a BJJ guy and KO'd a striker. Credit where credit is due.

    What about Lil Nog? Reckon his recent slump against Wrestlers shows the way the Tito fight will go? The winner of this one wont be the most relevant figher but they but themselves in line for a fight with Forerst/Rampage I reckon.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  The_Axe_Emperor on Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:17 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:
    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:Big Nog = The most disrespected fighter in MMA



    Nope, Ben, Frankie Edgar holds that title. Nog is a close second though.

    IMO however the Schaub KO was a fluke, he didn't look great at all in that fight, was getting tagged all night long.

    Laughing Id agree, I havnt backed Edgar once in his last 4 fights I think!!

    Yeah Nog did get tagged a lot but Lawler got tagged a lot when he KO'd Manhoef, Kongo got tagged a lot when he KO'd Barry, whoever won by KO put on the better performance.

    He didnt look great but you have to say it was an improved performance considering he is a BJJ guy and KO'd a striker. Credit where credit is due.

    What about Lil Nog? Reckon his recent slump against Wrestlers shows the way the Tito fight will go? The winner of this one wont be the most relevant figher but they but themselves in line for a fight with Forerst/Rampage I reckon.

    Think Frankie is the only champ to go into three consecutive title defended as the underdog!



    You could also argue that Lawler- Manhoef and Kongo- Barry were flukes, however both Lawler and Kongo are renowned strikers with KO power, Nog is not. Which leads me to believe Nogs was a fluke and the other twos were not.

    Also disagree that whoever gets the KO win performed better, example; Cung Le vs Scott Smith 1. Le battered him from pillar to post and lost. I think we both know who performed better in that fight.


    Reckon Lil Nog will outwork Tito, split decision maybe. There's life in Tito yet, he's always game and will be as long as injuries permit.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:07 pm

    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:
    The_Axe_Emperor wrote:
    rudeboyben84 wrote:Big Nog = The most disrespected fighter in MMA



    Nope, Ben, Frankie Edgar holds that title. Nog is a close second though.

    IMO however the Schaub KO was a fluke, he didn't look great at all in that fight, was getting tagged all night long.

    Laughing Id agree, I havnt backed Edgar once in his last 4 fights I think!!

    Yeah Nog did get tagged a lot but Lawler got tagged a lot when he KO'd Manhoef, Kongo got tagged a lot when he KO'd Barry, whoever won by KO put on the better performance.

    He didnt look great but you have to say it was an improved performance considering he is a BJJ guy and KO'd a striker. Credit where credit is due.

    What about Lil Nog? Reckon his recent slump against Wrestlers shows the way the Tito fight will go? The winner of this one wont be the most relevant figher but they but themselves in line for a fight with Forerst/Rampage I reckon.

    Think Frankie is the only champ to go into three consecutive title defended as the underdog!



    You could also argue that Lawler- Manhoef and Kongo- Barry were flukes, however both Lawler and Kongo are renowned strikers with KO power, Nog is not. Which leads me to believe Nogs was a fluke and the other twos were not.

    Also disagree that whoever gets the KO win performed better, example; Cung Le vs Scott Smith 1. Le battered him from pillar to post and lost. I think we both know who performed better in that fight.


    Reckon Lil Nog will outwork Tito, split decision maybe. There's life in Tito yet, he's always game and will be as long as injuries permit.

    Yeah I dont totally count Tito out, and aparently there a lot who see him winning as per the poll. Evans smashed him but Evans looked in the best shape of his career and Tito took it on short notice, I dont read too much into it. But for me Tito likes to stand a lot more these days than he used to (probabally because he hangs about the Wildcard gym) I think this will be the deciding factor because punch for punch there isnt many people going to beat Nog.

    Davis used his wrestling to totally stiffel Lil Nog but I cant see Tito having the same explosion to replicate that fight. I think Non SD is a good call, I was thinking 29-28. I see a close one too.
    -------------------------------------------------------

    Your harsh on Nog, just because he isnt mainly a striker doenst make it lucky, he may have ate shots but he backed Schaub right up against the cage and it wasnt a 1 shot KO with his eyes closed hoping to hit, he rocked him and finished him... I think it was a great showing... and Nog always gets hit a lot! It doesnt take away from his win IMO, Sylvia punished him far far more, Herring practically KO'd him! He has taken worse beatings to win is all id say. I just hope he can take out some of those bombs Mir throws affraid
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  superman_punch on Thu Oct 13, 2011 6:16 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:
    Tito fought Evans in a number 1 contenders fight and now he is Irrelevant?

    Come on seriously you reckon if the impossible would have happened and Tito won he'd be above Rampage, Shogun, Lyoto, Hendo for a title shot? That was Dana hyping up a fight attempting to make it relevant if ever iv seen it. It would be like saying if Matt Hughes would have beaten Kosch he'd have been in line for a title shot. It wouldn't have happened.
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    Once Mohawked Pete
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:13 pm

    No disrespect intended to Nog, but no one could claim that he is anywhere near the fighter that he was.

    It's not so much the calibre of opposition, but the manner of the defeats, he never looked in the game against Cain or Mir. I just doubt that he can get anywhere close to the man he was. Okay I'm sure that folk will point to the Staph and Meniscus issues for his recent losses, but if anyone says, might it not be age? Then it's being disrespectful? I've said the same about a few fighters.....I don't like to see great fighters of the past, being used as 'cannon fodder' in the division, and that is what I see happening with Nog. I'm sure that, somewhere in Dana's head, he expected Schaub to walk through Nog and therefore get elevated towards a title tilt.

    With regards to Tito, I hate the fucker, and his record since beating Shamrock in 06 reads 7fights 1 win, 5 losses and 1 draw, if this was anyone else they would be lucky to get a fight in the UFC, yet alone being mentioned in the same breath as some of his opponents. Just my take on a fighter I don't like though.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Thu Oct 13, 2011 9:18 pm

    Eh... I dunno Pete, hes 35, When would you call a heavyweights peak these days? Lesnar is year older than him.. Walad Klitschko is the same age and as sad as it is hes one of the top p4p boxers sadly!

    Getting demolished by Cain is pretty much standard practice. No one has beat him, 3 figthers have made it out of the 1st round with him and only 1 the distance. A bad KO loss but its hard to judge him by that.

    Also he is 20lbs of mostly muscle heavier than he was in the Pride days, maby he isnt ripped but he bulked up while he was off, I posted an article before the Schaub fight on it. What I dont get is how he KO'd Schaub and everyone seems to still shit on him. Nog in his 41 fight career never put to sleep a striker of Schaubs level.

    Outboxed a 28 year old with 7 KO's in 8 fights whos style is Boxing, maby not perfect Technically etc.. but Schaub was a ranked successfull Striker who only really threw hands and Nog knocked him out.
    ------------------------

    Where as Frank Mir takes time off, Bulks up and knocks down a ranked successfull striker (Kongo) and he becomes the baddest man on the plannet agian.
    ------------------------

    I dont think he will win but people thinking its a sure bet Mir wins shocks me, The guy trains with Anderson, Aldo, JDS, Machida, Lil Nog etc.. his striking might just be getting better because of the level of Blackhouses guys striking. Look at Chutebox back in the day, Iron sharpens Iron who you train with is a massive part of who you are.

    The thing that swings it for me is the Chin to power ratio, Mir hasnt a good chin his losses are all KO's but has a lot more power and size, Ive a bad feeling Nog will be too confident in his striking and not concentrate on getting the fight to the ground.

    Heres hoping though, I think behind Wanderlei watching Nog loose has been the worst part of being an MMA fan! Crying or Very sad Laughing

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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  Once Mohawked Pete on Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:05 pm

    rudeboyben84 wrote:Eh... I dunno Pete, hes 35, When would you call a heavyweights peak these days? Lesnar is year older than him.. Walad Klitschko is the same age and as sad as it is hes one of the top p4p boxers sadly!

    Getting demolished by Cain is pretty much standard practice. No one has beat him, 3 figthers have made it out of the 1st round with him and only 1 the distance. A bad KO loss but its hard to judge him by that.

    Also he is 20lbs of mostly muscle heavier than he was in the Pride days, maby he isnt ripped but he bulked up while he was off, I posted an article before the Schaub fight on it. What I dont get is how he KO'd Schaub and everyone seems to still shit on him. Nog in his 41 fight career never put to sleep a striker of Schaubs level.

    Outboxed a 28 year old with 7 KO's in 8 fights whos style is Boxing, maby not perfect Technically etc.. but Schaub was a ranked successfull Striker who only really threw hands and Nog knocked him out.
    ------------------------

    Where as Frank Mir takes time off, Bulks up and knocks down a ranked successfull striker (Kongo) and he becomes the baddest man on the plannet agian.
    ------------------------

    I dont think he will win but people thinking its a sure bet Mir wins shocks me, The guy trains with Anderson, Aldo, JDS, Machida, Lil Nog etc.. his striking might just be getting better because of the level of Blackhouses guys striking. Look at Chutebox back in the day, Iron sharpens Iron who you train with is a massive part of who you are.

    The thing that swings it for me is the Chin to power ratio, Mir hasnt a good chin his losses are all KO's but has a lot more power and size, Ive a bad feeling Nog will be too confident in his striking and not concentrate on getting the fight to the ground.

    Heres hoping though, I think behind Wanderlei watching Nog loose has been the worst part of being an MMA fan! Crying or Very sad Laughing


    I hear what you're saying Ben, but, how many wars has Nog been in? Lesnar is a terrible HW IMO, but even he has only really been in 2 genuine tests (physically at least) Carwin and Cain. Yes Cain will show many a HW up, I just think sadly, that he is heading the same way as Wandy and Randy.

    With regards to the Schaub fight, I for one thought that Schaub would beat him, but, from what I can remember, there wasn't much love or respect for Schaub on these pages prior to the fight. As I've said, nothing would give me greater pleasure (other than Bitchping getting his ass handed to him by Sonnen) than to see Mir get KO's by ANYONE, let alone Nog, and I do give Nog a chance, but, I see a Mir win early on, just because of Nog's fighting style. Here's hoping though.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:53 pm

    Ive more faith Nog can keep his career going than Wanderlei. The Leben loss was really the last nail in his coffin to be honest. He is pretty far from being ranked but Nog is still a top 10 guys. I know what you mean about the Chin going being the end of their careers especially when they arent the hardest guys to hit... fingers crossed like you say im sure it would make a lot of people on here happy to see Nog winning this one, lets hope that Chin holds up.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  redmeanie77 on Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:40 pm














    Tito is going to lose this, he doesnt have the wrestling to take Lil Nog down and his striking and cardio is shit. Lil Nog decision or late tko. Dont forget Nog stuffed most of Baders takedowns and all Phil Davis takedowns in 1st round, and they are much better wrestlers than Tito ever was....


    Big Nog is getting another ass kicking from Mir though.
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    Re: Return of the brothers Nogueira

    Post  rudeboyben84 on Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:53 pm

    redmeanie77 wrote:












    Tito is going to lose this, he doesnt have the wrestling to take Lil Nog down and his striking and cardio is shit. Lil Nog decision or late tko. Dont forget Nog stuffed most of Baders takedowns and all Phil Davis takedowns in 1st round, and they are much better wrestlers than Tito ever was....


    Big Nog is getting another ass kicking from Mir though.

    Yeah he did manage to stuff a lot of Baders TD's, he should have won that on "Octogon controll" because he wanted it standing and kept it there.

    If One of the Nogs win ill be happy.

    Red who you see next for Mir and Lil Nog if they win?

    Im thinking that Carwin vs Mir II makes a lot of sence though it would be great to see one of the SF heavies brought over, Mir vs Werdum would be cool too.

    Lil Nog needs to go after Rampage I reckon. Rampage might be relieved to find someone who will give him the Boxing match he is after...

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